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snowbound

MORE DENALI GEAR

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Parkas that work? Anyone use a DAS Parka on Denali, is it warm enough? What have you used that worked well?

 

Denali boot liners, how do they work for normal spring/summer mountaineering conditions other places? My Koflach liners gave out this weekend but the shells are still decent, if I go with the intuition Denali liners will they be too hot for general mountaineering?

 

 

 

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The Liners that come with the Artis Expes are fine for Denali and likely just as warm as the intuitions, pleanty of people use stock liners. The important thing here is to have a good overboot if you are going stock liners and possibly a supergaitor also.

 

Intuition liners are great but if you are spending the $$ and buying them for cold places they will pack out and loose their warmth if you use them all the time for summer trips, you might just want to save them for winter cold.

 

Cant comment on the DAS, I'm sure people have used them on more technical climbs, but most people on the west butt use down.

Edited by BlackSheep

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I used a Wild Things Belay parka on the West Butt. Worked fine.

 

Also, don't bring a plastic spoon. I sat on and broke my only spoon.

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It was my experience that bringing an extra pound or 2 of insulation (between the jacket and the bag) are worth it since you know you'll stay warm in whatever conditions. After all, when you're already hauling 100lbs of crap up there, what difference is 2 more?

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I have used the DAS Parka for 4 trips to the Alaska Range, including Denali, and think that it is a great choice. I will be using one again this year as well. For a climb that would start in the first few weeks in May I would recommend layering another light insulating layer under the coat. The Patagonia Micro Puff pullover is perfect for this piece and a few other companies make similar products. Later in the season, your base layers, softshell, and wind layers under your parka would likely be adequate.

 

I typically recommend more of modular system for insulation as opposed to one giant layer (parka, down suit) that would go over everything. The conditions and temperature on Denali, and on most large scale expedition peaks change from the base of the mountain to high camp. Having a few different combinations of warm layers leading up to a parka is much more practical for most folks on these trips and on future adventures elsewhere in the world.

 

The disadvantage of having feet that are too hot is excessive perspiration right? The Intuition liners are not permeable and they act as a micro VBL in my experience with them. By this I mean that even though your feet are toasty, they don't tend to sweat any more, I think less, than in regular liners that tend to wick moister away from you foot allowing for continued perspiration. The Intuition liners are the best thing out there for cold and high mountaineering in plastic boots. The liners are warmer and lighter than all others including the high altitude model that Koflach puts out. The biggest down side, besides cost, is that they do pack out after time. You can reform them a time or two successfully, but their life is limited. For this reason I would recommend against them if you intend to spend a lot of time on multi-day trips in warmer locals, and can't/don't want to afford two sets of liners.

 

Good luck!

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I would recomend the Sub Zero SL Hooded Jacket It is a good coat and is not too expensive. I would also recomend the Intuition Liners they are super warm and when you are high on the mountian you will enjoy the extra warmth!!

 

Ditto the MH Subzero SL, but I opted for the hooded parka for a little extra length.

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In the past I have bought boots with alveolite liners and skipped the regular liners all together. As folks say they do pack out and get trashed easier than the others. When that happens I just buy another pair and then when they are gone so are the shells. I did that with several pairs of plastics. Nerver found them too warm for other stuff.

 

As for parkas I have Feathered Friend Frontpoint. Good all round jacket for anything in the Americas.

 

I agree with Climzalot that having layers is nice - but there is a balance other wise some stuff will stay in the pack and never be used. I usually have a fleece jacket, one piece climbing suit and a down jacket as my outer layers.

 

 

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A down jacket that weighes 29oz (DAS weight) will probably be warmer. I found the DAS warm enough this year. I also love my Montbell UL jacket (8oz) which is warmer than fleece, lighter and more compressable. It also layers better than fleece since it slides between layers.

Then the Patagonia R1 hoody (the shit) and my mid weight wool long sleeve zip T. It did not stink like my old cappy (although I did).

Shell, I took he Houdini but it stayed in the pack or tent most of the time. only used it on the lower glacier.

I pulled out my Wild Things Event jacket (16oz) when I needed a shell. I was very happy with it. My GTX jacket are for impressing the local school kids at the mall.

 

Jedi

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I have used the DAS Parka for 4 trips to the Alaska Range, including Denali, and think that it is a great choice. I will be using one again this year as well. For a climb that would start in the first few weeks in May I would recommend layering another light insulating layer under the coat.

 

Do you think Arcteryx SV Fission will be good enough in mid May. I think it's warmer than DAS. I worry about hood. It's tinner than any hood on lighter down parkas.

http://www.arcteryx.com/product.aspx?Fission-SV-Jacket

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The last time I was up there, 2 of us had Outdoor Research Overboots and the other guy had Super Gaiters. He liked them but they were totally trashed by his crampons by the end of the trip. My OR stuff is still in great shape, I think they hold up much better that the neoprine. Layers is your best bet. I had a plain old cheapy gangsta puff-daddy $100 Burlington Coat Factory down coat and was plenty warm with other layers (Could not afford anything more at the time). We started in late April and it was really cold (-60ish f) down lower around 10k on the upper Muldrow. Best advice I have is bring the warmest bag you can find. Marmot CWM(-40f) + bivy sack + polypro bag liner. Well worth the $/weight. I only had a -20 down bag and froze my ass off at night even with the bivy, polypro bag liner, down booties, parka and fleece layers on too. My buddy with the CWM was toasty the entire trip though. I've seen some nice used CWM's on ebay for around $300 lately. Have a good trip, be safe.

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Worn intuition denali's on rainier in summer - socks wet all the time, but temp felt evened-out - not too warm or cold.

 

Worn DAS on Rainier in winter - plenty warm at -10F - had to open it up while moving around.

 

RE: Fission jacket - not too keen IMHO for a gore shell on a poly jacket -- don't really need to protect the fill from wet like some people like with down, and keeping your layers separate and distinct for their purposes mayb be a better choice.

 

 

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Did anyone from your group roped up with skis and snowshoes on the same rope? Do you think this will cause bit problems for either one?

Z

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I was on the West Buttress last year, mid-May to mid-June. I used a DAS Parka and found it adequate. I also took a WM down vest, which I wore continuously for the four weeks and made a great layer under the parka. I also wore a light merino T the entire time, and over that a heavier merino zip-T which I never took off either.

 

I used Intuitions in my plastic boots, Superfeet in the sole, and 40-Below overboots on top. It was a good system, though I wound up coveting the Olympus Mons a couple of other guys had. No, I don't think you'll find them useful for general mountaineering. I also had the big OR Viesturs down mitts. Very warm.

 

The bottom line is that there is going to be gear you buy for Denali that you just won't use down here. Literally, 50% of your gear is for the last 20% of the climb. Just believe that the risk of frostbite is real and it jumps on you quickly. And once you're debilitated, your team has to take care of you, and you can't return the favor. You can't run a stove, you can't bag snow, your ass will be a mess, you're a burden, and it's a crappy feeling and it ruins the entire trip. Not to mention the nauseating pain of rewarming. The Intuition liners come out to roughly $15 per toe. Big down mitts, $10 per finger. Both are worth it, in my opinion.

 

As for skis and snowshoes together. Well, on the way up (assuming the West Butt, of course), the only hassle will be right out of KIA going down Heartbreak Hill. After that, it shouldn't be a big deal. Down from 11K, however, you'll probably wind up wanting to throw the snowshoers in a crevasse. Or, if possible, rope up separately. Skis are definitely, definitely better.

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Did anyone from your group roped up with skis and snowshoes on the same rope? Do you think this will cause bit problems for either one?

 

I have done this - the snowshoer is the crevasse poodle while the skier is the anchor. Otherwise it is not too much of hassle. That said it is better to have the same transport on the same rope as it is more efficient.

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We used skis only the first two days - up to 11,000 ft. After that we switched to crampons. We picked up our skis on the way out and ended up putting them on the sled. Skiing with a pack, a sled, in mountaineering boots is fairly ridiculous. Not to mention it cost an extra 50 bucks to get the skiis on the plane. If I were to go back I would definitely bring plastic snowshoes.

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