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Chad_A

Westside road access?

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Looks like you can get up the road right now on Sundays only, 10am-5pm, and that's by bicycle or foot.

 

I'm guessing that it'll opened to vehicles when the road to Paradise is opened (?), but I'm hoping it's sooner than that. Anyone heard any different?

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The road is open assuming you want to walk in, and you could permit to climb on the west side remaining in the park for the length of time on your permit. Day use is as you've stated on Sundays

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According to an earlier post by Mike Gauthier, there is no access to the West Side road except on Sundays from 10 am to 5 pm. This means that for the time being your trip needs to begin, and end, on a Sunday.

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Did I hear some rumor like "VIP's" are getting shuttled up by car to paradise for recreational climbing, skiing, and other recreation? Perhaps the shuttling is going on up the westside also?

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Did I hear some rumor like "VIP's" are getting shuttled up by car to paradise for recreational climbing, skiing, and other recreation? Perhaps the shuttling is going on up the westside also?

 

Not VIPS, just the commercial interests (hotel and guide concessions) and their paying customers (people staying at the hotel and guided climbers). So the road is good enough to drive, but only if you are a business making money in the park, or their paying customer.

 

I knew this would happen and it irritates the living shit out of me. Whatever park person made this call is a fuckhead and can go to hell.

 

If it's (the road, the park, or any portion thereof) closed to the general public it should be closed to everyone. Period.

 

:mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:

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Don't think of just yourself dude. What about the staving tourist community that thrives on the mountain's access? Not only were the roads on rainier wiped out by the floods but also the local economy. This alows the local businesses to stay open. Plus I doubt the roads are completly refinished. so what happens when they let complete inexperienced idiots to drive up a most undoubtedly treachorous road? I feel ya dude bout not being able to drive up, but honestly Be stoked and hoof it up like a real mountainier.

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Have to agree with CascadeClimber on this one. The parks are there for the people not for the concessions to make money. At least the park could do is a random lottery to allow others access to the mountain. No different than other parks with limited resource protections put into place.

 

That I said I do agree perhaps at this point in time allowing personal cars up the might NOT be a good idea. Who is driving the rigs for the concessions? Perhaps the park should require for every two concession tourons they take 1 public touron (and be able to charge them a fair price for the ride).

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Or instead of risking some randome "lottery" winner to drive up there why not have that person pay the guiding company to go up? Come on people common sense. The drivers the compainies use are more experienced then your avarage Joe on a weekend trip. I know this to be a fact cause I personaly know a few of the drivers. Its to risky to let just any one up. Again, look past the selfishness of your statements and relize the locals are taking a kick to the balls right now with limited tourists. Pay the locals to take you up or Hoof. Don't complain.

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The road in question is not paved and is only one lane wide. There are no turnouts and the trees (and snow) come right to the edge. Traffic can only proceed in one direction at a time. Even the snowplow has gotten stuck in the past. All it would take to bring all traffic in and out of Longmire to a halt would be for one car to proceed down this road while another was proceeding in the other direction, causing two cars to meet head on with no way to turn around. It is simply not practical to allow individual drivers in. In my opinion, the current plan offers the most benefit to the most people, within the practical constraints of this small thoroughfare.

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Oh say can we see,

By the dawn early light,

what so proudly we hail,

corporate interests have might.

 

If your a touron you see,

with no business practicality,

you'll be shunned like the rest,

because your dollar has no interest.

 

(sung to star spangled banner)

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You guys are totaly missing the point! Norman thanks tho for the backup. Honestly if thats not enough to shut these ignorant people up then this is pointless. To weekend_climber Look at the companies its supporting by allowing the guide services to go up. RMI IMG yeah but what about the little restraunts and hotels that benifit. You guys who protest this are so ignorant. Look at the greater cause. which is THE LOCALS! I'd agree if some how Microsoft or some other huge coporation was benifiting, how that would happen I have no clue, but ther not. Its the goverment helping out the little people. Get off the poser punk anarchy train.

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And I suppose if they opened it up to the ignorant anarchists, the little businesses would not be better off? I'm betting that all these paying clients of RMI, and the other guide services are buying all sorts of trinkets from the local rummage stores. :rolleyes:

 

Why can't the road be open to one-way traffic with posted times of when traffic is going in what direction?

 

If the businesses didn't have some sort of contingencies for this type disaster and loss of business, then it's hard for me let them be catered to by or government.

 

How much of this money is going back to the park?

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If the businesses didn't have some sort of contingencies for this type disaster and loss of business, then it's hard for me let them be catered to by or government.

How is a small business supposed to plan ahead for the contingency of a 90 percent drop in business for six months? Do you think Microsoft has a contingency for that sort of drop in their business? And if Microsoft did suffer such a loss due to a natural disaster, would they not be likely to seek government assistance?

It is not currently possible to uphold an ill-defined ideal of universal access. The road is washed out and is being fixed. If you want to be on the mountain so much, ski in via the White River Road: no hotel or guide reservation required.

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The national park service has always been in bed with major corporate interests. Our first national park is a perfect example. Yellowstone was created as a national park in part to provide the Northern Pacific Railroad with a tourist destination. The railroad was instrumental in stimulating interest in the Yellowstone as a place for recreation. It is a classic case of you scratch my back; I'll scratch yours. That the park service should continue to cater to the interests of major economic players should not come as a surprise. If Mt Hood Meadows didn't exist, do you really think 35 would have been repaired so quickly and in such difficult conditions. Unfortunately no such major players exist on Rainer, and the road will be repaired at the state's leisure and only those with serious capital or clout will be given any preferential treatment.

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You can't tell me that a couple of people getting shuttled up are going to spend more than a few token dollars at Copper Creek or Alexanders. I know the businesses are hurting. My folks live down near their and go up a lot.

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That the park service should continue to cater to the interests of major economic players should not come as a surprise. If Mt Hood Meadows didn't exist, do you really think 35 would have been repaired so quickly and in such difficult conditions. Unfortunately no such major players exist on Rainer, and the road will be repaired at the state's leisure and only those with serious capital or clout will be given any preferential treatment.

 

dude, mt. hood is not a national park.

 

look, the only reason that the road is still closed to the public is that there have been some 30-odd loads of multi-ton rock being hauled into the park daily for repairs between the nisqually entrance and MP 9 - coupled with regular snowplow operations, the installation of MAJOR new culverts, and the occasional river flowing over the road. i don't agree with whoever decided to let the concessions operate despite the closure, but it is only a handful of car trips, not daily traffic going up and down the road.

 

i don't understand all of these (what sound to me like) conspiracy theories. the park wants to open to the public ASAP. but the road has to be SAFE and SECURE first, right?? there's such a thing as liability...

Edited by Duchess

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Of course, who cares if the guides and their client (or as they call them in the Rockies, guests) aren't safe while driving up and down the road. Are they subject to the "Open only from 9am-5pm on Sundays" restrictions?

 

If Microsoft had 90% of their business fall off, they would lay people off. How is that different in a small business?

 

[liberal rant]You probably want the government to bail out GM and Chrysler because they couldn't keep their money grub'n hands out of the honey pot, too.[/liberal rant]

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HAHAHAHA its so funny how your getting angry that the local little guys are getting special privlages. Guarentee you wouldn't Bitch if it was you getting special access. Hike up you pansey. Or is that to much work for you? Honestly anarchy is just as bad as strong democratic and republican beliefs, and when people like Weekend-climberz sit here and raves on about Gov. and how they specialy cater to companies you sound so self centered and rediculous. Have any of you complaners stoped to think about the locals? and how this helps out the economy? Theres no way in hell you can say it doesnt help. Whether indirectly or not. Money flow into the ashford area is a boost in their cripled economy.

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Aussie69 ... a few years a I did hike into the park when the Carbon River road was closed. Only climbers on that side of the hill.

 

I really can not understand your point on this - why should we as the general public give up our access to the park while someone who has a paid to be guided up the allowed in? The parks owe no obligation to any concession to ensure their livability the same as the government owes Boeing any obligation when a contract is not renewed.

 

I do feel bad that folks are strugling, sure I do. And if got a chance to go into the park from the westside would I stop and have meal or something, more than likely. But what is difference between me and joe smuck touron who is doing a snow course with IMG?

 

 

 

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Hike up you pansey. Or is that to much work for you?

 

I climbed that bitch when I was 15 years old and the only routes that do interest me are accessed on the westside or via ipsut creek/mowich lake. Try sticking your foot in your mouth a bit farther?

 

I'm playing devils advocate because it's sickening to see another "airline" type bailout when things up there are so f$#ked up. You would have thought they would have spent the money that they are using to build the new visitors center on making the roads better. Has worked stopped on that project while the roads are all messed up....hmmmmmm, let me think :rolleyes:

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Regardless of your take on shuttling into the park for concessions, it is complete BS to not allow hiking access to Westside Road. Thanks for nothing.

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Everyone take a breath, news report today says main park road/nisqually entrance to open May 1 even while additional re-construction is taking place.

 

In the meantime, the eastside is accessible for the hardy, and any wishing to do a westside route ought to simply consider taking a week's expedition via the westside road.

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You can hike up the Westside Road if ya want to. You cannot hike on the road Mon-Sat. They can't stop ya from hiking over Mount Wow... go for it if you're so ticked off. That would show them.

 

 

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MSFT has a group of activists who have deal with RMI and the park. Each MSFT client would throw at least $2k and get a guided climb from RMI. RMI guides these ppl for free, so all the money go to the park. Last time it was about couple dozen ppl who participated in this program. Now, MSFT itself treats these donations as legit and doubles the amount. So in total park gets couple dozen times $4k at least. Not bad IMO.

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