joblo7 Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 jay b . their personal convictions over medical facts that have been established beyond all doubt? common sense and indisputable medical fact are another. YOU dont know that. long term studies on the effects of various vaccines on humans have not been completed yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
strumpett Posted January 5, 2007 Author Share Posted January 5, 2007 How do you all feel about parents who do refuse to treat their children's life threatening medical conditions, like diabetes, because they've elevated their personal convictions over medical facts that have been established beyond all doubt? I feel that is wrong. I also feel vaccinations have nothing to do with the problem listed above. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joblo7 Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 also, some vaccines maybe necessary but that does not justify them all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foraker Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 jay b .their personal convictions over medical facts that have been established beyond all doubt? common sense and indisputable medical fact are another. YOU dont know that. long term studies on the effects of various vaccines on humans have not been completed yet. long term studies of death from disease sure have Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
counterfeitfake Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 jay b .their personal convictions over medical facts that have been established beyond all doubt? common sense and indisputable medical fact are another. YOU dont know that. long term studies on the effects of various vaccines on humans have not been completed yet. You... you are coming very close to just arbitrarily saying stuff. A random sentence generator. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Macson Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 Ritalin is one thing, vaccination is another. Critical thinking about debatable benefits when the data is preliminary and ambiguous is one thing, irrational delusions that fly in the face of both common sense and indisputable medical fact are another. I think that you owe it to your child to make sure you understand those indisputable medical facts, and that you can weigh the risks and benefits yourself before making the decision to go forward with any particular treatment. I'm not saying that you shouldn't put a cast on a broken arm, or treat cancer with the amazing drugs that are coming out. I'm just saying that you have a responsibility as a parent to know the medical facts about those drugs. Especially when, like in most cases, those fact are disputable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
strumpett Posted January 5, 2007 Author Share Posted January 5, 2007 I think that you owe it to your child to make sure you understand those indisputable medical facts, and that you can weigh the risks and benefits yourself before making the decision to go forward with any particular treatment. I'm not saying that you shouldn't put a cast on a broken arm, or treat cancer with the amazing drugs that are coming out. I'm just saying that you have a responsibility as a parent to know the medical facts about those drugs. Especially when, like in most cases, those fact are disputable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foraker Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 Notice he said "medical facts" not "unproven anecdotal evidence you pick up from some random internet site run by someone not an expert in medicine and clinical studies" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ericb Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 Notice he said "medical facts" not "unproven anecdotal evidence you pick up from some random internet site run by someone not an expert in medicine and clinical studies" Although if you are looking for climbing advice, look no further than CC.com. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
counterfeitfake Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 Can you show me something credible that disputes the benefits of the standard vaccines children in the US are given? Polio, measles, mumps, rubella, tetanus, pneumonia, meningitis? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayB Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 Ritalin is one thing, vaccination is another. Critical thinking about debatable benefits when the data is preliminary and ambiguous is one thing, irrational delusions that fly in the face of both common sense and indisputable medical fact are another. I think that you owe it to your child to make sure you understand those indisputable medical facts, and that you can weigh the risks and benefits yourself before making the decision to go forward with any particular treatment. I'm not saying that you shouldn't put a cast on a broken arm, or treat cancer with the amazing drugs that are coming out. I'm just saying that you have a responsibility as a parent to know the medical facts about those drugs. Especially when, like in most cases, those fact are disputable. I agree with most of what you've said, but in those cases when it's not clear what the best medical decision is - and this is most assuredly not the case with regards to vaccination - the responsible thing to do is seek a second or third opinion from someone who has the qualifications necessary to make an informed decision. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. No one is entitled to their own facts. I would venture that Strumpet can get 456 opinions from pediatricians, and not one of them will support her decision. I also think that her children should be barred from public schools - this includes universities - until the time that they are vaccinated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joblo7 Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 thats like asking opinions from 456 republicans, not really usefull! you need advice from 'different' sources to get a picture.few reps,few dems.lots greens, type of thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Macson Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 Jay, I think you are right on that. And by the way, I myself made an informed decision to have all three of my sons vaccinated. I've also donated my own time and money to eradicating polio through my Rotary club. I hope Strumpette will come to the same conclusion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
counterfeitfake Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 thats like asking opinions from 456 republicans, not really usefull! you need advice from 'different' sources to get a picture.few reps,few dems.lots greens, type of thing. Totally! It's like how when you want to know how to fix your car you should talk to some horticulturists. It's good to get opinions from people who don't know what they're talking about, in addition to those who do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joblo7 Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 your being 'tupid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olyclimber Posted January 6, 2007 Share Posted January 6, 2007 It's good to get opinions from people who don't know what they're talking about, in addition to those who do. OMG! You captured the CC.com lightning bug in a bottle! Except for a little bit more of the former. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archenemy Posted January 6, 2007 Share Posted January 6, 2007 strumpett-- i am not going to open the "why" or "why not" vaccinate can of worms. as a parent and someone working in research related to vaccines, I can not endorse your failure to vaccinate. However if it's for religious reasons they'd be happy to open that can, chew them up, and crap them out all over you. Please use stall 140 this time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joblo7 Posted January 6, 2007 Share Posted January 6, 2007 thats like asking opinions from 456 republicans, not really usefull! you need advice from 'different' sources to get a picture.few reps,few dems.lots greens, type of thing. Totally! It's like how when you want to know how to fix your car you should talk to some horticulturists. It's good to get opinions from people who don't know what they're talking about, in addition to those who do. no you DUMB FUCK! from other QUALIFIED sources. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LandShark Posted January 6, 2007 Share Posted January 6, 2007 Is there a vacine that protects baby sharks from dolphin fungus? Dolphins are dirty freaking animals! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
counterfeitfake Posted January 6, 2007 Share Posted January 6, 2007 no you DUMB FUCK! from other QUALIFIED sources. Okay. Who besides doctors is qualified to give an opinion on whether children should be vaccinated? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archenemy Posted January 6, 2007 Share Posted January 6, 2007 not vaccinating you kid is like not paying your taxes because you don't like the current government. It's not all about your child, it's about the society. We'd still have polio and smallpox if people were so selfish. It bet you'd say your baby was old enough for a needle if it was full of antibiotics to save it's life from whatever you didn't vaccinate it from. Although disturbing and creepy, breastfeeding your kid until it's 3 is very healthy for the child. It is also a great form of birth contol. As long as you are lactating, your chances of getting pregnant are lower. Also, after three years of milking your tits will be so saggy that ain't no one gonna fuck you. Its a long term plan, really. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bstach Posted January 6, 2007 Share Posted January 6, 2007 Please use stall 140 this time. Also, after three years of milking your tits will be so saggy that ain't no one gonna fuck you. Your on a roll today, Arch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Couloir Posted January 6, 2007 Share Posted January 6, 2007 Notice he said "medical facts" not "unproven anecdotal evidence you pick up from some random internet site run by someone not an expert in medicine and clinical studies" Although if you are looking for climbing advice, look no further than CC.com. And of course good speculation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archenemy Posted January 6, 2007 Share Posted January 6, 2007 Please use stall 140 this time. Also, after three years of milking your tits will be so saggy that ain't no one gonna fuck you. Your on a roll today, Arch. Good audience good audience! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
layton Posted January 6, 2007 Share Posted January 6, 2007 The Facts: www.pubmed.com http://pubs.ama-assn.org/ http://iai.asm.org/ www.nih.gov www.cdc.gov http://www.vaccinesafety.edu/ and my favorite: http://w3.palmer.edu/smith/vaccinfo/default.htm Strumpett, whatever your sources are, go and check the actual PEER REVIEWED original journal article. If you are suspicious, check your sources. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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