Off_White Posted December 20, 2006 Share Posted December 20, 2006 (edited) This thread is only for updates from people involved in the current search on Mt. Hood to provide information updates as they become available. No questions, speculations, or discussion please. Note: we're working on getting a synopsis and starting point drafted and posted here, thanks for your patience. Edited December 20, 2006 by Off_White Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Off_White Posted December 20, 2006 Author Share Posted December 20, 2006 Portland Mountain Rescue website is here and offers daily updates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoodie Posted December 20, 2006 Share Posted December 20, 2006 I guess this no longer a "current search", but here are some pictures of my experiences up there during last week's search. Apologies for the watermark hack job, but the media poachers are rampant. Flickr Pics Also, some vids up on YouToob Moderators, feel free to wipe this if this is off your intended topic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iain Posted December 20, 2006 Share Posted December 20, 2006 Here's the current coverage on the north face of Mt. Hood if anyone was interested (12/17/2006): Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iain Posted December 20, 2006 Share Posted December 20, 2006 And for those with questions about what is where (can be confusing): Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iain Posted December 21, 2006 Share Posted December 21, 2006 Iain......What elevation is that picture taken from? How far is it from where it says Snow anchor/small cave to the bottom of the NF Gully? Thanks! I've no idea about the elev., it was from a helicopter, but probably about 9000ft. As for the distance from top to bottom, maybe a little over 2000ft? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Off_White Posted December 21, 2006 Author Share Posted December 21, 2006 No offense intended all, but this is a bare bones information only thread, so I've deleted comments, compliments and well wishes. Feel free to comment in another thread elsewhere on this board, or send your appreciation or condolences via Personal Message to the individuals involved. We're winding down coverage and focus on what is now officially a lower intensity body recovery operation. thanks Off White - Cascadeclimbers Moderator Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ihuntifish Posted December 21, 2006 Share Posted December 21, 2006 (edited) KGW story on Kelly James' autopsy: link Edited December 21, 2006 by Off_White Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
randita Posted December 21, 2006 Share Posted December 21, 2006 Sorry for my ignorance but are the Pearly Gates visible in the picture you posted or are they on the south side? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iain Posted December 21, 2006 Share Posted December 21, 2006 The Pearly Gates are on the south side of the mountain. It would probably have been brutal to look down into them on the day they topped out, and would be intimidating since they have not been down them before and there is currently a significant 15ft step to deal with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ryland_moore Posted December 21, 2006 Share Posted December 21, 2006 Look at the flickr pictures that one of the PMR guys posted. the ones labeled 061217_12 and _13 are of the hogsback and coming up through the Pearly Gates, albeit in low snow conditions. Looks a lot different in the spring when all the snow has filled in.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iain Posted December 21, 2006 Share Posted December 21, 2006 Yes, for those interested in the south side, it is currently in pretty advanced shape. It is not the beginner's climb that it normally is in the spring. That said, it is fun right now with great sticks through the length of the chute, which is pretty steep. This storm may change its condition. As I said there is a 15ft rime-featured step at the gates. Hoodie's photos show this stuff, including the floating school bus that gutted the chute (and almost us) with its rotor wash. I'm assuming they will reopen the mountain if they have not already. Just remember to keep some good stock photos of yourself available for the news if you go missing. This would be one of the weekends to not get lost/injured on the mountain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gslater Posted December 21, 2006 Share Posted December 21, 2006 When will the pictures from James' camera be made available for all to see? I saw a news report today that his family has decided not to release them to the public. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iain Posted December 21, 2006 Share Posted December 21, 2006 This seems as good as any place for this. Hope some find it helpful: Questions continue to be asked about the Mount Hood Locator Unit (MLU) after every search like this last one. Some of the media somehow still confuse them with PLBs and cellphones, and I have been asked to outline the program, so this is just to reiterate what the MLU does. Availability- REI, OMC, and the Mountain Shop all "rent" MLU transmitters to climbers. They are also available 24 hrs a day at the Mount Hood Inn at Government Camp. The rental shops test each transmitter in front of the climber renting it. Records are kept on battery life. A $5 rental fee covers the expense of this. History- The MLU program began back in 1986 in the wake of one of Mt Hood's largest tragedies, where a large group from the Oregon Episcopal School became trapped near White River Canyon, resulting in 9 deaths. It took three days to find the unmarked, buried snow cave, and by then it was too late for 7 of the kids and 2 adults. The Mountain Signal Committee built and tested the technology, then went through the Oregon legislature to get enabling legislation to use the system. Currently the USFS and Clackamas County Sheriff control the system. The MLU Transmitter- MLUs are small VHF transmitters attached to a sash. When the "ripcord" is pulled and the MLU activated, it sends out a tone at 168.54 mHz. These transmitters are not monitored full-time. Once a rescue is initiated, PMR will do an initial sweep of the mountain for an MLU signal. There is a check box to say you are carrying one on the sign-in sheets at Timberline, but frequently PMR will do a scan just in case you forgot to check the box, or if you didn't register. The MLU system is essentially a wildlife tracking system. During testing, MLU transmitters have been picked up 20 miles away. Transmitters deep in crevasses or under many feet of snow have been easily detected. However, line-of-sight rules apply. PMR can't find a signal on the opposite side of the mountain, behind a ridge, or deep in a canyon. The signal will also "bounce" off wet rock walls, making it confusing for the searcher at times. Should you use one? There is no doubt the MLU takes the "search" out of search and rescue. It has been used successfully in several winter operations on Mt. Hood. The technology, now 20 years old, still works well. It is not perfect, but it remains a powerful tool for PMR. Carrying an MLU does not guarantee a rescue. Sometimes accessing your location is impossible due to weather, avalanche, rockfall, etc. However, it does allow all energy to be focused on accessing your location and getting you out of there, rather than trying to find you first, which as you have seen can take days. Many climbers feel it is inappropriate to take technology along that replaces self-sufficiency. Many climbers do not bring cellphones with them for this reason. This is an understandable personal choice climbers make. Climbing is often viewed as an opportunity to escape society. This message is simply to let people know the MLU still does its job well, and if you wish to rent one, it is available as a tool for you to use, and will be used to find you if you get in trouble on Mt. Hood. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texan Posted December 21, 2006 Share Posted December 21, 2006 I do not mean to be either impertinent or irreverent about the deceased and the missing. I am respectful of what they accomplished in their lives, and of what you other climbers have related of your expertise as well. We guys here in Dallas who know/ knew Brian Hall do not climb (but wish we had the necessary skills) are trying to understand what happened up there on the NF of Hood. What is the general consensus among SAR and the non- rescue experienced climbers about how the 3 men got separated and what went wrong to cause the climb to end so tragically? Is it weather only, since Mr. James autopsy disclosed no pre-existing injury or illness before hypothermia claimed him? I know the storm was a very big contributor, of course, but these men were used to climbing in all conditions. An unknown variable such as loss of gear or a different type of accident? I know it doesn't bring them back, but we could accept our friend's presumed demise better if we understood what caused things to go so wrong. Thank you. I know this is not a SAR report, but I am not a troll and didn't want to ask in an area where no one from the forum is participating. I respect the regular members of this forum very much and wish you many years of happy mountaineering. I will be reading about your climbs here from now on. You have touched many lives through the telling of your own stories. Many of us have read quite a bit throughout CC.com. Play hard!!! Kenny Dallas, TX Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
randita Posted December 21, 2006 Share Posted December 21, 2006 Can someone tell me if there are many women involved in the SAR effort or on SAR teams in general? And if so, what are the most likely roles played by women on any of the teams? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary_Yngve Posted December 21, 2006 Share Posted December 21, 2006 Can someone tell me if there are many women involved in the SAR effort or on SAR teams in general? And if so, what are the most likely roles played by women on any of the teams? There are women involved in SAR, and they fill all roles. The gender imbalances of the past are slowly fading, and as more women get into climbing and the outdoors, more will volunteer for SAR. The highest percentage of women in SAR units I've seen are horse and dog units. Mountain Rescue has women who are solid climbers and can haul 50lb packs. When in the field I don't think about man or woman. I think that I can trust this person in being safe and getting the job done. Also, if you remember the Cindy Wysocki incident from a month ago, Sgt. Sidney Jackson jumped out of the helicopter to get to her. She rocks! http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2003440917_hiker21m.html?syndication=rss Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Off_White Posted December 21, 2006 Author Share Posted December 21, 2006 Summitpost.org has a good summary complete with pictures, timelines, and youtube videos: link When an official accident analysis is released, we will post it here. Until then, speculation is pointless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bboop Posted December 21, 2006 Share Posted December 21, 2006 Thanks for posting the pix. Thanks so much for the SAR efforts; I was so moved by your generosity and sacrifice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
randita Posted December 21, 2006 Share Posted December 21, 2006 Can someone tell me if there are many women involved in the SAR effort or on SAR teams in general? And if so, what are the most likely roles played by women on any of the teams? "The highest percentage of women in SAR units I've seen are horse and dog units." Hey, I resemble that remark! Thanks for your response and I got a good laugh out of that sentence. Hope you don't mind my pulling your chain. Happy Holidays and thanks to all the SAR teams and all they do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sean_beanntan Posted December 21, 2006 Share Posted December 21, 2006 Forgive the double post but i brought this over from the old treead in case folks misssed it. A few comments on SAR and how we plan a search may help some folk. ONE method is to use POA (probability of Area ) and POD (probability of Detection). After looking at all the available facts, the search area is divided into sections. Each section is given a POA priority ie the highest priority section is searched first etc. Each team going into the field has to ask/answer questions like, what is the percent chance that i can see/hear the missing person? what is the percent chance that the missing person can see/hear me? what is the percent chance that the person is consious/unconsious? what is the percent chance that the person would be moving if s/he could.? All these effect the probability of detection. If its cold and you are injured, you might be holed up in a tree well and so the POD is low and lower yet if you are unconsious. Please if this happenes to you. Mark the nearest Tress or Rock with some marker. OK so when you get back to SAR base and report in, all this info is takedn down. A POA of 1 with a POD of 50% means another team will go search the same area to try to bring up the POD to a number where we can say we think s/he is not there. At any time the Sheriff can look at the map and see POA and POD as each day developes. POA's are also subject to change as more data becomes available.....hope this is clear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iain Posted December 21, 2006 Share Posted December 21, 2006 Texan - your need for more info about your friend is very understandable. I think the only facts to be relayed publically right now are: 1. Mt. Hood in winter is an unforgiving place. Small problems can become life-threatening. Good turns to very bad quickly. 2. Based only on what was found, they made a choice (perhaps unknowingly) to keep moving or start dying. 3. Previous experience on this mountain would be helpful. 4. Climbing is dangerous. Sometimes you just get nailed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robk Posted December 21, 2006 Share Posted December 21, 2006 Cross posted from one of the other threads (mods - delete if it doesn't jive with how you are managing the threads).... While many have been following this story for its human drama, some have expressed interest in SAR and how to contribute or get involved. SAR and Mountain Rescue in particular have long histories and proud traditions. The teams (PMR, CMRU, Crag Rats, and EMRU) you've seen in action are outstanding examples of the units that exist in many areas. You may be surprised to find an MRA-qualified unit near you. MRA Regions and Units Contact your local team(s) to see how you can help. If you don't see a team in your area, contact the local Sheriff or emergency services agency and ask about SAR. Public support and dedicated volunteers keep these teams alive and ready when the call for help comes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fern Posted December 22, 2006 Share Posted December 22, 2006 The point of this thread is to provide a location to compile reports FROM the SAR people. Due to inability of people to understand this point, and continuing to ask pointless, irrelevant, and unanswerable questions that many find offensive in their intrusiveness, I am locking this thread. If you wish to post to this thread, PM Off White, gapertimmay or myself for access. As has been stated a number of times, the SAR report will be posted here when it is ready. Discussion may be appropriate afterwards, not before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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