Climber's Banned from Climbing

[Dannible]

Seriously though, we would all be so safe underground. Everyone living in a giant Walmart type place undergound; everything you need. Its paradise.

[cj001f]

He likened it when there are rip tides at the beach.

 

Hey, I'd be fine with a useless sign posted by someone who's a lifer and knows that it's a joke, and then that sign is widely and loudly ignored.

 

I love the riptide at my beach, and others, for surfing. Like a chairlift out to the break.

[dmuja]

Seriously though, we would all be so safe underground. Everyone living in a giant Walmart type place undergound; everything you need. Its paradise.

 

lemme guess, you wear black eye shadow and a black trench coat and listen to Korn?

[pink]

Funny how Kevbone and Pink, who used to be sort of irritating, now seem like blessed members of the fold, eh?

 

thanks?

 

 

[catbirdseat]

One can compare Bill O'Reilly to Washington State's people's initiative process. Some uninformed wacko get's an idea and thinks there should be a new law. There's a good reason we have a legislature. Those elected officials are paid to study all proposals and come up with good laws. People think they can become an expert on anything, like climbing, in one week.

[EWolfe]

Back to the days of outlaw climbing. I like it, bring it.

[pink]

Bill O'Reilly stated on his Fox show that he thinks climbers should be banned from climbing or going up on mountains when weather is or could be bad.

 

i figure bill would be against creating more government being he is a fox media guy. what a fucking jackass. just another crackhead commenting on something with no prior knowledge. i think we should ban the media. FUCK BILL O'REILLY. the guy probably couldn't climb a flight of stairs.

[Dannible]

Seriously though, we would all be so safe underground. Everyone living in a giant Walmart type place undergound; everything you need. Its paradise.

 

lemme guess, you wear black eye shadow and a black trench coat and listen to Korn?

 

Dude, have you not seen the news? Its a scary world out there. Trees fallin, storms brewin, bombs going off; I'm just looking out for whats best for America.

[KaskadskyjKozak]

 

We need the government to protect us from ourselves.

[Jason_Martin]

Post deleted by Jason_Martin

[pink]

i think we should give bill an open invitation to this thread.

[pink]

We don't have to defend our sport to anybody...

 

We constantly bicker within our own ranks about bolts and ethics and style...but this is within our community. That's fine. We can argue with one another about whether a route is sandbagged or about the value of bouldering or about anything else. But all these arguements rely on the fact that our community understands and values the culture of climbing.

 

Those who comment on our culture from afar don't count. They don't know anything about our sport or our lifestyles fashioned around it. They don't understand us or why we do what we do. The reality is that they are as alien to us as we are to them. While we're in the mountains with our best friends having the times of our lives, they're watching TV. While we're arguing about the ethics within our sport they're still channel surfing. And when one of ours is lost and the whole community wants to go up and look for him, they're still zoned out watching commercials and wondering if they should go out for McDonalds or Burger King before the next episode of "Survivor" comes on.

 

And here we are...there are numerous comments in the Hood threads where we defend ourselves and the dead. There is a thread on why people take risks, and there is a thread on avy beacons. And then there's this thread...

 

Nobody is going to ban climbing.

 

And nobody is going to be able to explain our motives to people who spend all of their leisure time sitting in front of Fox News or shopping at a box store that smells like vomit mixed with disinfectant. So why try? Even though the right wing nut jobs want to kill it, we still live in a free country...

 

And we don't have to defend our sport to anybody...

 

Jason

 

 

the freedom of the hills.

[sexual_chocolate]

I don't know.... is it really that bad of an idea to close the mountains down when the weather looks bad?

[dmuja]

J-man, WORD!

 

Im reminded of something I read many years ago..

 

This SPEC OPS guy was once interviewed and his comments were something along this line:

 

"..While Im out in some remote place across the world away from anything safe or friendly, sleeping under rocks and eating bugs just trying to survive, someone is in their home and worried about the "waxy yellow build up" on their kitchen floor.."

 

nice contrast I thought

[pink]

I don't know.... is it really that bad of an idea to close the mountains down when the weather looks bad?

 

i think the key here is to educate peolpe, not treat them like children. those guy's made a few bad choices and so have you and i. not grounds for a closure. there ought to be a law against rush limbaugh.

[EWolfe]

I don't know.... is it really that bad of an idea to close the mountains down when the weather looks bad?

That is a slippery slope when one allows weather forcasters and other outsiders to dictate what one can or cannot do.

 

I am in full agreement with Jason.

It is our world as climbers,we take the risk. Sure there is the rescue element that involves outsiders, but one just has to look at the multiple compromises that brings to our community to have more than a little hesitation about whether the rescue ops are a good reflection on our endeavors.

 

You takes your chances. The people that hold the expectation of being bailed out of a bad environment and make bad decisions are the WORST reflection on climbers.

[Dannible]

 

While we're in the mountains with our best friends having the times of our lives, they're watching TV. While we're arguing about the ethics within our sport they're still channel surfing. And when one of ours is lost and the whole community wants to go up and look for him, they're still zoned out watching commercials and wondering if they should go out for McDonalds or Burger King before the next episode of "Survivor" comes on.

 

Jason

Yep, I often wonder why so many people, even friends of mine, would rather spend so much of their time watching fake people (in most cases) live their lives on TV rather than going out and living for themselves.

[mattp]

Jason,

 

While I agree that climbing is pretty cool, and I completely agree that they shouldn't close mountains based on a weather forecast, I strongly disagree with the notion that anybody who doesn’t climb must do nothing else but waste their time in front of a TV.

 

There are all kinds of people in this world, with all kinds of interests. We are no more heroic as climbers than is those whose hobby is riding horses or collecting stamps. And many many people who would never dream of climbing do some very cool things with their spare time. Really. We do what we do for ourselves.

 

The fact is, we DO have to defend our hobby sometimes. Many people do not understand why someone would take the risk involved in such a silly game as mountain climbing. Not all are fans of Hemingway whose famous quote celebrated the valor in bullfighting, auto racing, and mountain climbing. And, truth be told, some of us do end up requiring rescue and sometimes those who come looking for us take significant risks. Arguing that "we are better than everybody else," is not only wrong, it is counterproductive. Closer to the point, I think, is that those of us who enjoy climbing really feel that we derive a lot from it, and that it is as valid an activity as boating or hunting, hobbies that are perceived as more "mainstream" but which generate significant searches and rescues and lead to occasional accidents or deaths.

 

Matt

 

[sexual_chocolate]

I don't know.... is it really that bad of an idea to close the mountains down when the weather looks bad?

 

That is a slippery slope when one allows weather forcasters and other outsiders to dictate what one can or cannot do.

 

I don't know, sometimes having an objective observer making the call, Jeff Renner maybe, might be the best thing.

[Off_White]

I don't know.... is it really that bad of an idea to close the mountains down when the weather looks bad?

 

Maybe you're just stirring the kettle, but yeah, I think it's that bad an idea. Who makes the call? What are their criteria? Who's going to enforce it? What will be the benefit? I can't think of any answers to those questions that will encourage me to embrace the concept.

[Dannible]

Jason,

 

While I agree that climbing is pretty cool, and I completely agree that they shouldn't close mountains based on a weather forecast, I strongly disagree with the notion that anybody who doesn’t climb must do nothing else but waste their time in front of a TV.

 

There are all kinds of people in this world, with all kinds of interests. We are no more heroic as climbers than is those whose hobby is riding horses or collecting stamps. And many many people who would never dream of climbing do some very cool things with their spare time. Really. We do what we do for ourselves.

I agree that climbing is not the only thing worth doing, but I feel like there are a lot of people out there who don't really do anything. It could just be my generation, but I know a lot of people who's lives consist of some combination of a job they hate, video games, beer, and a TV.

[sexual_chocolate]

I don't know.... is it really that bad of an idea to close the mountains down when the weather looks bad?

 

Maybe you're just stirring the kettle, but yeah, I think it's that bad an idea. Who makes the call? What are their criteria? Who's going to enforce it? What will be the benefit? I can't think of any answers to those questions that will encourage me to embrace the concept.

 

well maybe they could have some sort of a council with Jeff Renner at the head which watches the weather, and then they issue their verdict, maybe using colored flags or strobe-lights or something, or those bright lights that get used at night for car sales and carnivals.

 

and the criteria they use are things like wind meters, and humidity detecting devices, and the other things that weathermen use, like temperature gauges and stuff.

 

and the enforcement people will be the weathermen themselves, because they will be the most convincing to tell the people on the mountains not to go in because the weather is coming in and it is bad.

 

and then the people who will benefit will be the people who then won't be climbing, of course.

[dmuja]

I didnt take Jasons post as to be making climbing "more heroic" than other endeavors. But I do think that goal setting-achieving types, athletes etc, independent free-thinking solitude seekers and such have a much better chance of understanding climbers then your average excessive consuming couch potato, which is to say your average American, which is to say your average fatty. Your right about one thing though Matt, we DO have to defend ourselves because the damn sure is A LOT more of them then their is us. And they don't want none of their tax $ going to rescue "those irresponsible types". Just look at what the Hood threads brought forth..

[BobC]

Your stupid comment about promoting slaughter in Iraq is like telling Texans to stay off Mt. Hood.

[pink]

never been banned from climbing. got banned from spraying once.

Edited December 19, 2006 by pink