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cluck

3 Lost on Mount Hood

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come on guys keep it positive! there are still three men up there. spray aboput their mistakes when they are down safe and warm.

 

trust me, there is nothing worse then sitting in a hole on top of a volcano knowing there are people out there looking for you and your family and friends are worried sick. been there done that. they know they fucked up, nuff said. nobody loves the master of the obvious.

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Why did they just now find the climbers note at the ranger station? You would think they would have checked that one first.

 

Good question. I was wondering the same thing myself. I was ready to give up hope last night, knowing what kind of weather was coming in, and hearing all week about their 'fast and light' campaign. If they've known about the note all week, and just now released it to the media and/or gave it to Airborne to hold up in a plastic bag like Exhibit A for the cameras to view, a lot of people like myself, who have been expecting the worst after hearing Thursday's weather forecast, wouldn't have been ready to needlessly throw in the towel. Knowing this now, my confidence is renewed, that as long as both Kelly and the other two were able to split up resources for both caves, I'm thinking the odds of survival just went way up if they can keep their air holes open with all the new snow. No, I have no experience with this, just an interested party, absorbing all the media reports like an average Joe who has never climbed anything. I'm in Texas and it's a long ways to the nearest snow capped mountain.

I've been glued to the TV and internet, and just now hearing about the teenagers who lasted 13 days(?) in 1976(?), who obviously had less experience than these guys. That would have been nice to have known sooner as well. I'm not a big fan of the media when it comes to the promptness and accuracy of their reporting.

Thanks to everyone who is helping the search rescue teams in any capacity. I'd be there myself if I thought there was some way I could contribute. I just found this discussion board, and can already tell it's the place to be for anyone interested in all the names of the locations on the mountain that the media is throwing around. They just don't have the time for a true description/map/routes of the mountain. A video article by the Oregonian newspaper was the most informative I've seen, and all they showed was the relative altitude of the cell phone pings. Too bad I don't know climbing terminology, cause right now it's a foreign language. Maybe one of you guys who know what's going on could freelance with the newspapers or TV stations and put out something good for us, so that when you find these guys, their locations will mean something to those of us less initiated. Not knowing the mountain or anything about climbing, just following all the reports is an adventure. Some of the rescue crews photos are phenominal. My favorite one looks like a moonwalk. Has anyone run into Neil Armstrong or Buzz Aldrin?

Edited by LHwildcats76

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come on guys keep it positive! there are still three men up there. spray aboput their mistakes when they are down safe and warm.

 

trust me, there is nothing worse then sitting in a hole on top of a volcano knowing there are people out there looking for you and your family and friends are worried sick. been there done that. they know they fucked up, nuff said. nobody loves the master of the obvious.

Listen to this guy. There is nothing more demoralizing than hearing a ship send out the call and knowing you will not get there in time. No one is a god therefore we all error and pay for it some how. Pray to what ever deity you believe in and praise the rescue committee not matter what. They are the group that pays with their soul.

May the gods of Valhalla bless them all.

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I am a dear friend of Brian Hall. I just wanted to let you know how grateful and appreciative we are about all of your positive comments, experiences, and good vibes. I also want to thank and praise all of you that remain positive even when some of the postings are less than fitting about Brian and his two friends, Kelly and Nikko. I am not a climber, but I am gaining great insight and utmost respect for the climbing community. Much like Brian as one of my best friends believes in me even when I may not believe in myself, you guys believe in each other. AMAZING!

 

GOD BLESS

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How long were you on GP before you got rescued Bone? It was a couple of days at least wasn't it?

 

4 days, 3 nights past our due date. all-be-it not nearly as harsh as these conditions,still cold wet and white-out just the same. we were well enough off and didn't want people coming for us but the rescue op was out of our hands. the endless waiting for the storm to break was the worst part.

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I found this board when I was looking for information on the 3 climbers. I have to agree with another poster who said you guys are an amazing group! While not a climber, I sure respect those of you who are. My thoughts and prayers go to the 3 missing climbers and to their families. I pray tomorrow they will come off the mountain and be reunited with their families.

A question: How will the climbers know the storm has passed and they can come out of their snow cave?

Stay strong Brian, Kelly and Nikko - the best of the best will be there for you soon.

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past co-worker of jerry cooke- fellow attorney in brooklyn.

The boy... all the boys will make it.

Saturday- 12 noon.

UKEGEN

 

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A question: How will the climbers know the storm has passed and they can come out of their snow cave?

Well I've never been in that situation, but I think I would peep through the entrance periodically until the sky clears. No clouds, no storm. For the moment at least.

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before the climbers will be able to commit to descending (or they are found) they will likely have to sit through torturous brief clear windows that shut down arohnd them in moments after they've mustered the energy to get up and move.

 

they should probly wait for the support teams and try to signal them as best they can.

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A question: How will the climbers know the storm has passed and they can come out of their snow cave?

Stay strong Brian, Kelly and Nikko - the best of the best will be there for you soon.

 

If the guys are carrying an altimter they'd be able to detect a rise in pressure, which would let them know that stable weather was on it's way. I'm guessing that at least one of the three had one of these.

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Yes Elleth, that was the very clip I was referring to. At first glance, not a bad piece of journalism, except for their unqualified statement of fact that Kelly is injured. If that is the conclusion they've drawn, so be it, but it's not a known fact. It's a known fact that Kelly called his family on his cell phone, not just a 'believed' fact. Their reporters also have mental telepathy, claiming that the other two do not have cell phones. In a video interview today, one of their wives said he did have a cell phone. Not sure I can trust anything they are reporting. The lines they've drawn on the mountain look pretty iffy to me as well. Can snow cats really get that high? Can a red line depicting the 8,500 ft point on an 11,000+ ft mountain really be that close to the top? Does it matter? No, but typing this gives me something to do while in 'hurry up and wait' mode.

 

The press conference today with Airborne said the Ranger station note was found yesterday, but they did not know why it wasn't found earlier. This video clip is the only thing I've seen that reported it before today. Sounds like a conflict of information. If the rescuers have known these facts all along, I don't know why secrets are being kept, nor can I understand an earlier post as to why they would keep secret the exact coordinates of the ping. Why would the head of the Airborne search team not be told of the note, in preference to the media being told? Doesn't make sense to me.

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I think the note thing is confusing because of typically inconsistent/inaccurate descriptions of when/where they were found. Due to what I can only presume is a lack of familiarity with the area, I've heard various conflicting (and very often incorrect) references to "ranger station", "campground", "campsite", "hut", "lodge", "shelter", "Cloud Cap", "parking lot", etc.. Someday I'm sure there'll be a consistent and accurate timeline put together, but I wouldn't expect that for a while.

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So anyone know if this much is accurate (ie, actually stated in a note left by the climbers) at least?

 

 

--

 

(a) They park their truck on Wednesday 12/6 "near Tilly Jane trailhead"

 

(b) They leave a note dated Thursday 12/7 and (presumably) hit the trail and begin the approach

 

© Their plans are to camp ("sleep") Thursday 12/7 (night?) "on route" (likely somewhere still on the approach?)

 

(d) Their plans are to climb the NF and descend the South side on Friday 12/8

 

(e) They then plan to retrieve the truck on Saturday 12/9

 

(f) In an "emergency storm" they plan to descend Cooper Spur

 

(g) They will have "food and fuel" in the truck (stashed?)

 

--

 

I have heard mention of 2 different notes left by the climbers.

 

I have heard mention of "extra food and fuel" supposedly carried by the climbers - or is that what was stashed in the truck?

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Don't worry. The searchers & sheriff have what I believe to be a fairly accurate and consistant understanding of events. The multiple news agencies just tend to get a bit confused with the details. Most reporters aren't climbers and don't know much about the mountain. They're just doing their best to interpret the information they get from the sheriff or overhear from searchers and much is lost in the translation. Most don't know the difference between Cooper Spur Inn (down by SAR base), Cloud Cap Inn (up at 5600 feet), Cooper Spur Shelter (rock shelter just above tree line), Tilly Jane trailhead (also down by SAR base), or Tilly Jane Cabin (up near Cloud Cap).

 

 

That youtube video Elleth linked to is actually quite accurate depiction of the topography of the north side. I'm impressed.

 

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I remember reading about that specific note several days ago. This is a total guess, but maybe the note was "re-released" to the media to help quiet all the negative chatter out there about these guys being ill-prepared. I cannot imagine how hurtful those comments are to their families and friends.

 

On a somewhat related note, here's a great video of the weather on Mount Hood last Friday. Send the holier-than-thou dimwits here when they rip the guys (incorrectly) for not checking the weather:

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You've summarized the oregonian video, made several days ago. I noticed the same thing and interpreted them to say the food etc was stashed in the truck. I don't know why the climbers would mention that, unless to say that if a storm hits, and they're stranded in the truck after making it down the mountain, they'll be OK in the truck. After reading your post and revisiting the video, now I think they meant they'll bring food down with them to the truck. What good would food stashed in the truck do them in the mountain? Don't know how high up the truck is on the mountain ('Tilly Jane Trail Head near the Cooper Spur ski area'). Can you get snowed-in in a truck at that location, with roads unpassable below? They say another note was left at the 'U.S. Forest Service Office on Oregan 35, south of Hood River' and the reporter describes the mere leaving of said note as an 'unusual step' to take, and that the note describes the route they will take. I don't know the area, but how many U.S. Forest Service offices are there on Oregan 35 south of Hood River?

Chris, the Airborne leader, showed the note written on red paper found yesterday at the 'Hood River Ranger Station.' He held it up in a plastic bag, with a yellow post-it note attached saying 'Hood River Ranger Station.' Forest Service aka Ranger station? A reporter's follow up question specifically confirms when and where the note was found. Chris may be mistaken, or the person who handed it to him may be. Journalists are always trying to 'scoop' the competition. Again, the Oregonian was the ONLY media source I see that has reported the note before today, several days ago in fact. Chris said more climbers should leave such notes, while the paper described it as an 'unusual step.' So in this case, the unusual thing is apparently a good thing.

 

zl27, I've had concerns that the 'fast and light' technique did indeed make them look bad as if they were trying to beat the weather and bet their lives that nothing goes wrong. I assumed that surely they would check the weather forecasts - then did they fail to allow a cushion for mishaps that might slow them down? Well if they had everything they said they did in the note, then they DID plan for any mishaps. Without the delay, the weather would not have phased them. They'd be at Timberline before it hit. In his cell phone call, Kelly didn't say 'I'm in trouble' or 'call for help' or 'if I don't talk to you again, I love you' etc etc. At first I thought that he wouldn't say such things so as not to worry his family, even if he believed them. Now, after learning of the 2nd note, I really don't think he thought it was any big deal, that he'd just ride it out. His family said he simply expressed concern about the impending weather. I just wish he had told Karen, 'if I ever get stranded, don't be alarmed if I don't call until the weather is good enough to insure reception. In the meantime, I'll be conserving my battery' etc. Who knows, he may have an extra battery. I always took two on vacation for my video camera, charging both each night. It just pains me to see her so stressed and worried.

 

I just read a good Oregonian article from today, where the then 18-yr old in the 1976 ordeal gave a rare interview for the 'family and friends' of the three up there now. Yes, it served it's purpose of being encouraging. Wish I could thank him for it. I know I never want to be that cold and that wet at the same time. I've gotten caught on my motorcycle, cold and wet, and that was miserable enough, thank you.

 

No wonder the confusion. The Coopers and Tilly Jane must have been popular, with the powers at be wanting to name multiple things after them. I'd be confused on my first visit as well. I guess the local TV reporters haven't been around the mountain much.

 

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dmuja

 

I can speak of A-F as I was with Donn V on Thursday. I saw their vehicle parked at the Tilly Jane Sno Park with a note explaining their plans and why they had not purchased a snow-parks permit. The note indicated that they were going to sleep on route but it seems they decided to stay at the Tilly Jane cabin. I did not actually talk to them, I skied by the cabin and noticed somebody was there, while Donn stopped in to retrieve an item.

 

The note said they planned to descend the south-side and then pick up the vehicle after the road (HWY 35) was opened on Saturday. Also, the note indicated that they would descend the Cooper Spur route in an emergency, which seemed an odd choice, but like I mentioned I never talked to them about it.

 

I can't speak for g), but I think I recall something about that in the note. I believe the second note was found in the guest register of the Tilly Jane cabin.

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Despite the lack of details and accuracy in their reporting, I have to give the media credit for not jumping on the blame wagon.

 

And I have to say that watching Rick Sanchez's failed attempts to learn survival skills has been a welcome and amusing distraction. What a buffoon!

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The note in the warming hut where they spent the night and left the $20 would be a 3rd note.

 

CBS news showed a diagram of how a snow cave should have a laying area that is elevated above the entrance. Then they proceeded to have an 'expert' dig one out of the snow, but he didn't bother elevating anything. I've always wondered how you assure yourself of the snow not caving in on you, especially when a storm lays an extra foot or more of weight on top. As for the vent, I guess that's a precaution in case the entrance gets clogged(?) Seems like an escape route for the heat you're trying to retain. I'd rather just keep my entrance clear.

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Thanks Fargo,

 

Would Coop spur be an odd choice for a NF bail-out even with good conditions and WX? Im not familiar with the N side of Hood, just the south.

 

D

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I've never climbed Cooper Spur but I have gathered from others' experiences that, although not a technically difficult descent, it can be dangerous especially up high with bad snow conditions. I'm not sure how easy it would be to reach Cooper Spur from the North Face gullies.

 

I thought it was odd because I initially assumed that they meant, upon summiting, they would descend the Cooper Spur if conditions were bad, which didn't make any sense.

 

Other than the note on the car and the brief interaction my buddies relayed to me, I can't say anything that will benefit this discourse.

 

That being said, let's hope this weather window gives the rescuers an opportunity to find all three of them safe and sound.

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Cooper Spur as a descent route has some challenges. The upper part of the route is: fairly steep (50ish degrees), exposed (falling could easily mean a long/nasty fall to the Elliot glacier), tends to catch a lot of wind...

 

It is a very direct way off the mountain if you completed a N. side route.

 

Cheers,

 

Rob

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Thanks Fargo,

 

Would Coop spur be an odd choice for a NF bail-out even with good conditions and WX? Im not familiar with the N side of Hood, just the south.

 

D

 

Could certainly be used, but it wouldn't be a first choice. Lots of people have gotten hurt/killed descending the Cooper Spur route, due to it being fairly steep and having an ugly fall line. But to be fair, it should be mentioned that women in very long skirts and pointy little boots used to go up and down it over a hundred years ago...

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