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gooniegoogoo

tying two ropes for a rap

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tying two snaf.gif for a snack

 

Sobo, you may be more skilled at pulling ropes, or perhaps don't do as much rapping on broken rock as I do. And I guess you must also have a greater fear of the EDK than I do. I agree that a stuck rope is a rare occurence (the last time for me was several years ago), but it can be a major problem and I am comfortable with the EDK.

 

If a partner prefers something else, I'll use something else. If not, I'll opt for the EDK most of the time.

 

I wouldn't begin to infer that I'm more skilled at anything any more than anyone else, except how bad I suck at everything. cantfocus.gif

 

As you surmised, I do harbor an inherent fear of the EDK, not having used it and fearing it too much to use myself as the test subject. I'm well aware of all the test data, yet I still find it uncomfortable to even contemplate using it. All it takes is once...

 

Refering to the discourse from another thread, maybe I should add to my parting words at rappels: "I hate rappelling - and I especially hate the EDK!"

 

Agreed that your course of action regarding partners and the EDK is a wise compromise. No sense having a fistfight over it on a belay ledge 500 feet off the deck! yellaf.gif

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Exept that I would NOT tie a back up for the Euro Death knot. Adding a back up will increase the chances of getting it stuck, and reduce the advantage.

 

And note: it is not the same as an overhand (if you tie the overhand "correctly" as a follow-through knot).

water3.gif

 

The overhand is probably harder to untie than the double fisherman's, not as secure, and not much easier to pull over an edge.

 

 

Your pic is what I learned as an "Overhand Bend" or "Water Knot", 'bend' being the overall term for a knot used to join two ropes. Yada yada....

 

What I'd like to point out is that those tails in the photo are awfully short, especially for webbing.

 

Why variants of the overhand fell from grace, in favor of variants of the Figure 8, involved, I recall, claims of greater knot security, greater knot strength, and less tendency to become un-untyable post loading. For knots never to be untied...runners and nut slings (yeah, remember those?) I went to the double fishermans as it seemed to never come loose.

 

To this day, both for frequent work applications and on those increasingly rare momentw when I actually climb something I still use the Fig 8 both for tying in and for joining ropes of equal diameter.

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yellaf.gifyellaf.gifyellaf.gifyellaf.gifyellaf.gifyellaf.gifyellaf.gif

 

I studied this for a few moments and I still can't figger WTF that clusterfuck is about! yellaf.gif

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2 doubled fig 8s on a bite looped into each other,

backed up with an overhand and biner clipped around the rope on each side,

and backed up again with single fisherman stoppers on each line.

 

Wow! You could rap down inside your truck with that pig!

Just dont pull your rope down cuz half the mountain will come with it!

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I always use the EDK when I rappel with a second EDK snuggled up to the first - for some of you this could mean two wrongs makes a right. I use the same knot when I floss every night. This setup has never failed me and I am confident that it never will.

 

And I love rappeling, but I do avoid it when practicable mostly because a simple mistake can easily lead to a simple outcome - death or worse. I had a good friend, Ken Patterson, lose his life to it using a well established / much used anchor that failed. That was thirty years ago and of course it still haunts me.

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No-ones mentioned it so far so I thought I'd see if anyone else has heard of this. Instead of a simple overhand (EDK) or a simple overhand with a second overhand tied right above, has anyone done an overhand with two loops before feeding the tails through. I don't have a camera handy so I'll try my best to explain it. You basically do the same knot as one half of the Double fishermans but with both ropes. So instead of doing the overhand with one wrap around and putting the tails up the hole in the center, you do 2 wraps around and put the tails up the hole in the center. One half of a double fishermans but with both ropes at the same time.

 

Anyone following that has a camera, rope and knows how to post a picture on here? Someone showed me this one but have rarely hear of anyone else doing it.

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The rappel knot is so controversial, I always defer to my partner(s) on what to tie! If they agree, I'll choose EDK. I don't know why it bothers folks so much. I love the way the knot is small and stays flipped up when pulling.

 

Among folks I know here in Germany, the term "Euro-death knot" seems to be unknown.

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Yes, it's me, mattp! yellaf.gif

 

So I went climbing with CatManDoo over the weekend at Lightning Dome, and when it came time to rappel, CMD tied an EDK. We discussed this thread for a second, and had a laugh over it. Before departing, he grinned and said, "Well, you can re-tie any knot you want after I'm off." or something similar.

 

So I watched the knot as he rapped to the next station, and I was reassured. I completed my first three rappels on an EDK this past Saturday, and am proud to announce that the EDK has found a new protagonist in me! grin.gif

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there are some very interesting articles on the EDK, as long as the users know how to use it, it is very safe but the knot can until by movement against the rock and with a new rope or a stiff rope.

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You should always use this knot:

 

5852rap_knot.jpg

 

Just pull yellow! Anything else is asking for trouble.

 

OMG! hellno3d.gif you're rapping off a non-locking biner!!

 

belt and suspenders, man.... belt and suspenders

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You should always use this knot:

 

5852rap_knot.jpg

 

Just pull yellow! Anything else is asking for trouble.

 

OMG! hellno3d.gif you're rapping off a non-locking biner!!

 

belt and suspenders, man.... belt and suspenders

 

What, only one sling?

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You should always use this knot:

 

5852rap_knot.jpg

 

Just pull yellow! Anything else is asking for trouble.

 

OMG! hellno3d.gif you're rapping off a non-locking biner!!

 

belt and suspenders, man.... belt and suspenders

 

What, only one sling?

 

Not only that, but look at the tiny little shrub it's looped around...

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