Cobra_Commander Posted July 13, 2006 Share Posted July 13, 2006 X-post from smithrock - -- The USFS is proposing to make the Skull Hollow a fee use campground. I understand the compground is getting a great many users including climbers, horse campers, mountain bikers, hunters and the occasional "permanant" resident, and they do not have the resources (read $) to maintain the facility. The Smith Rock Group has helped pay for pumping the pit toilets over the years but the forest service has no budget for maintanence, toilet paper and oversite. The proposal is to make it a 5$ per day use for the existing facilities, no real plan on adding water or much else. Not sure if the fee is per user or site. The forest service is accepting input and will be organizing a study group to discuss implimentation. The approx schedule is about 1-1/2 year away. You can contact the Grasslands FS office to give your input at aroberts@fs.fed.us or call direct to 416-6640 or you can post your opinoin here and see if there is any consensus among climbers. -- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winter Posted July 13, 2006 Share Posted July 13, 2006 Well this sucks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cobra_Commander Posted July 13, 2006 Author Share Posted July 13, 2006 pretty crazy seeing as you used to just drive into those fields until you had some space to yourself. Â I'd gladly bring my own tp to avoid paying for that place Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olyclimber Posted July 13, 2006 Share Posted July 13, 2006 Ahh...the start of the cycle: first you pay for basic services, but then you've got to pay for enforcement. Soon enforcement costs will drive the price up and most of the money will go towards enforcement. Then they'll need to build new offices to house the administration of enforcement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weekend_Climberz Posted July 13, 2006 Share Posted July 13, 2006 Everyone should boycott climbing at Smith Rocks. In fact, I'll let you know when I'm headed out to climb there and you can have it that weekend. I love having the place to myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mountainmatt Posted July 13, 2006 Share Posted July 13, 2006 And then the CHUDs come... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
powderhound Posted July 13, 2006 Share Posted July 13, 2006 that place is being overrun maybe it put some people back in the bivy sites Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billcoe Posted July 13, 2006 Share Posted July 13, 2006 Sounds like the forest service is trying to re-invent itself so as to not justify losing jobs. I say let them go get real jobs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chelle Posted July 13, 2006 Share Posted July 13, 2006 If they are going to start charging I hope they actually start maintaining the facility... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olyclimber Posted July 13, 2006 Share Posted July 13, 2006 hopefully they can hire additional enforcement officers to come around and wake non-payers up at 5:30am and make them pay up or kick them out, like at Red Rocks. that would be sweet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cobra_Commander Posted July 13, 2006 Author Share Posted July 13, 2006 the red rocks campground is where ex-nazi officers and retired meter maids go to die. Â you best not park an extra car in a site for more than 10 seconds if you don't want to be subjected to 4 hours of goosestepping. Â I salute you mein kampfuhrer! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jens Posted July 13, 2006 Share Posted July 13, 2006 This really sucks. With this development, the numbers between the bivy area and skull hollow will certainly even out a bit. It will now be a bit of a wash, Skull hollow = fires, but drive .....Bivy area= showers & no drive but no fire (or partying) I guess the no fire thing keeps the noise down for sportos trying to get a good night sleep to redpoint their projects. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cobra_Commander Posted July 13, 2006 Author Share Posted July 13, 2006 also the cost of driving out to grasslands from the park is not insignificant these days. Â the free for all atmosphere of the grasslands has been a big part of the smith experience for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billcoe Posted July 13, 2006 Share Posted July 13, 2006 Well, I guess we'll all be dirtbagging in a plush 3/4 of a Million dollar home in Eagle Crest, sitting in the hot tub at night or watching the wide screen HD TV, catching a Racketball game in the AM before heading out after crouissants and a Latte. Â Â Bastards. Â Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duchess Posted July 13, 2006 Share Posted July 13, 2006 This does suck. I have always felt pretty grateful/surpised to have a somewhat-decent place to camp with decent toilets, for free. But I don't feel too great about paying to camp somewhere without water... to me that should go hand-in-hand, esp. in the desert. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phillygoat Posted July 13, 2006 Share Posted July 13, 2006 Funny thing is: Ask me nicely to donate to the facilities and I'm all for it, but charge $5/ night and I get grumpy... Â I already pick up any trash I see out there so $5/night is steep for TP, IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MtnHigh Posted July 14, 2006 Share Posted July 14, 2006 The area is not nearly large enough for current use. On popular weekends it is a zoo. There are 5+ vehicles in some of the camps. If strict management is put in place which usually includes defined camp sites allowing only 1-2 vehicles each, it will be difficult to just 'pop in' and snag a camp site. Â And what impact will additional management have on the yearly cc party? Heaven forebid! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LUCKY Posted July 14, 2006 Share Posted July 14, 2006 I smell infastructure coming car camping at smith walk to climbing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crimper Posted July 14, 2006 Share Posted July 14, 2006 Why don't you people spend your time and energy actually contacting the forest service and registering your opinions with them - since it some cases a concerted public outcry has actually had an effect on government response - rather than engaging in your insular and impotent bitching and moaning? i swear that most of you would rather be repressed and oppressed so you have some weird kind of "crag cred" as opposed to standing up and being counted by the real world beyond the crag. I am going to back my words up and send a message to the forest service at aroberts@fs.fed.us. How many of you impotent whiners will do the same? It's going to take about 5 minutes of my time nd I'll feel that I at least tried to help the situation. But again, some of you would rather just cry in your keyboards and long for the good old days. Nostalgia kills the future if you let it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winter Posted July 14, 2006 Share Posted July 14, 2006 message sent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crimper Posted July 14, 2006 Share Posted July 14, 2006 I meant my last post as a call to arms. Looks like "Winter" got my point, so far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alpinfox Posted July 14, 2006 Share Posted July 14, 2006 Do you really think an email is going to do anything? Â Perhaps a written letter would be better? Â In any case, it seems that fees are inevitable. There is service being provided (restroom maintenance and TP) with no fee required. How long did you expect that to continue? Â Anyone have any idea what the annual cost of maintaining two of those toilets is and supplying them with TP? Wild guess: Maybe $8000? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crimper Posted July 14, 2006 Share Posted July 14, 2006 We can also debate the question "Do you really think an email is going to do anything?" to death, but would that really achieve anything? Â My point is that if you write an email, you might actually achieve something, but if you don't write an email, you definitely will not. Â My uncle once said that you earn your right to bitch about politics through voting - if you didn't exercise your right to vote, you shouldn't bitch about the results later. Same thing applies here, IMHO. Besides losing a few minutes of your time, what do you stand to lose by casting your vote on the proposed fee? Â (and yeah, I also thought the BLM would make this decision, not the forest service) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billcoe Posted July 14, 2006 Share Posted July 14, 2006 Why don't you people spend your time and energy actually contacting the forest service and registering your opinions with them - since it some cases a concerted public outcry has actually had an effect on government response - rather than engaging in your insular and impotent bitching and moaning? i swear that most of you would rather be repressed and oppressed so you have some weird kind of "crag cred" as opposed to standing up and being counted by the real world beyond the crag. I am going to back my words up and send a message to the forest service at aroberts@fs.fed.us. How many of you impotent whiners will do the same? It's going to take about 5 minutes of my time nd I'll feel that I at least tried to help the situation. But again, some of you would rather just cry in your keyboards and long for the good old days. Nostalgia kills the future if you let it. Â Great point Crimper, however, some uf us like to do both! And 60 seconds is about all it takes to fire off an email. Â This technique is called full service bitching and moaning, wherein full coverage and blanket spray is utilized for full effect. You email the FS, then spend more time loudly yeowling like cats in heat on the internet till someone like yourself gets sick of it - crys uncle - and tells everyone to STFU! Â My email to the forest service had a subject line of "Hugely Opposed to Grasslands camping fee". With arrows, bar charts and text straight from the group W bench for the body of the message. Â Take care and thanks for lighting a fire under some of these folks too! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alpinfox Posted July 14, 2006 Share Posted July 14, 2006 Email is the most easily dismissed form of correspondence. A phone call or snail mail letter are probably more effective. Here is some more contact info: Â Crooked River National Grassland 813 S.W. Hwy. 97 Madras, OR 97741 Â (541) 475-9272 Â You can submit a comment/letter to them through their online feedback form HERE Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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