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Alpine_Tom

Can't self-register

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I never registar, especially for little T. I climb everything in one day...I guess I have a valid excuse now [smile] Seriously, I go to the mountains to get away from regulations. Dumb crap like this bothers me. People who don't climb telling climbers how it is gonna be. You wouldn't believe how many joes at work said, "I can't believe they let climbers but themselves in danger...we have to pay for it...what do they risk their lives for...there should be laws to stop people from doing dangerous stuff." Blah, blah. [big Drink] I am thinking the JB's need to turn the tv off cause that is the cause of the US turning to crap. Just my opinion. Maybe I just think we are selling choice under the guise that creating more laws will protect our belief that the world can be perfect as long as you follow these rules. Law 10 billion 565 thousand 229.90 --- Don't walk on the left side of the sidwalk. There is a 155 dollar fine. 3000 new law enforcers will implement direct intervention by seizing and ticketing any violators. Repeat violators will be imprisioned for life. [Wazzup] Oh wow, I wrote all that. Hmm. How do you say, "I will get off my stool now" [big Grin] ...

 

Jason...

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well, it is definitely lame when they make these changes and don't bother to make an effort to inform the climbing community. isn't there some new parking rule at Paradise too? I am so pissed about them doing that and not communicating it that I am ignoring it..

 

A ranger told me that usually what they do if they bump into someone unregistered is register them over the radio right there and then tell you (on the honor system) to pay on your way out.

 

If I want to go in when they are closed, that is what I will do. I think they should provide for self registration at least in one place (which is still plenty inconvenient it you want to climb on the N side, but that is the tradition, so I am cool with sticking to that).

 

I don't really like breaking rules, but if they are going to start getting this ridiculous, I definitely will.

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I know a group of 3 gapers who drove through the front gate to paradise at 10 pm, climbed the mountain and drove back home only paying for gas and food. PERMITS? WE DONT NEED NO STINKING PERMITS!!

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I called the MR climbing conditions number yesterday (to look into conditions on Little Tahoma) and discovered that they no longer allow self-registration.

This means, among other things, that one-day climbs are a thing of the past, unless you are so fast you can start after 7:00 AM. Otherwise, I guess they want you to show up by 1:00 AM (when, according to the recording, the climbing ranger office closes) and hang around the parking lot all day taking up a parking space.

 

The climbing ranger I eventually spoke with was pretty sympathetic, he said he’d told his superiors the same thing, but I guess it’s about as open to negotiation as trail park permits.

 

The really annoying part is that, had I not gotten the answering machine, I wouldn’t have known this. It’s not anyplace on their website that I’ve noticed, and it seems like a fairly important change in policy (as of last fall, I was told self-registering was fine) ought to be advertised fairly explicitly.

Maybe the thing to do is just go, and if you’re caught, say “gosh, I didn’t realize, here’s my fee.” And if you’re not caught, then the hell with them.

 

I guess this is part of the ongoing process of turning the Park into an RV destination and keeping out those smelly climbers, who don't buy souvenirs or postcards, or even pay tribute to RMI.

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Hey Snivelers

The no self-registration rule has been in effect for a number of years; so I don't believe that there is any significant change to the system. If anything, the exception to this reg. is during the winter when visitor use limits are NOT in affect and self-registration is possible. Remember that a MAJORITY of the climbers on Rainier are beginners and new to mountaineering. The Park Service must plan for this and manage it accordingly b/c guess what, they must protect and preserve for everyone, not just a handful of "smelly climbers." If everyone was allowed to self-register at will during the summer, the high camps would be grossly overbooked, crowded, etc. Moreover, it has been my experience that the climbing rangers will work with you whenever possible. No system is perfect, they know it and they try to accommodate.

And to limit your paranoia boys and girls, there are no new parking regs at Paradise. So don't get too pissed Hollycimber

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Not only are the Rainier feds lurking behind every tree, bolder and hut, but now they have infiltrated cc. What's our world coming to [Confused][Confused][Confused]

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quote:

there are no new parking regs at Paradise

In the last couple of years they've implented a rule that doesn't allow your car to be parked overnight at Paradise unless you have reservations at a campground or one of their Inns.

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i feel inclined to chime in on this one...

"gov watch dog" is pretty much on the money about the self registration policies. there are no new rules about self registration that i know of. it's been the way it is now for the last 13 years that i've been here. basically, you can self register from october to may (unless the ranger station is open, then they ask you register in person). only during the summer does the NPS require you to get a permit in person (due to the limits at the backcountry and high camps). and to reveal something more, if you call ahead b/c you have some sort of issue with access, we will generally try to work with you to: 1. get a permit, 2. stay compliant and 3. have a safe and successful trip. it's not always possible, but we do try.

 

sorry figure eight, but your information is also incorrect about parking... there are no new parking rules at paradise, i'm not sure where you're reading this. the only relatively new parking issue is that ALL rmi clients are required to take a shuttle with RMI (this has been the case for the past few years). so, if anything, the rmi clients might be a bit inconvenienced, but nothing has changed with regard to the public parking. anyway figure eight, what are you parking overnight for at paradise if you're not climbing, backpacking, camping or staying somewhere in the park? do you plan to store your vehicle in the paradise lot indefinitely?

 

and mtn high, since i qualify as a "fed," would you prefer that i not post correct information on this site? ceratinly, i'm not lurking anywhere...

 

mike

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Thank you for clearing that up, Mike. When I was told over the phone that I COULD self-register last year, it was in November. I didn't understand that it was only allowed during the off-season.

 

You mention that if we "have an issue with access" then you will try to work something out. That certainly sounds promising, but when I talked to the climbing ranger on Wednesday (I didn't get his name, sorry, he sounded young, does that help?) he made it sound like there was nothing he could do, that's just the way things are.

I am probably not going to try to do any more one-day Rainier ascents, but I'm sure there are plenty of people who are interested in that. But I can't imagine setting aside two days for Little Tahoma. Besides, if it's a matter of restricting access to high camps, then a one-day climber is by definition not going to affect that. In fact, by not allowing self-registering for one-day climbers, you're increasing the burden on campsites, since it's not possible to do a one-day climb starting at 7:00 AM.

I don't particularly want to be an outlaw (I reserve RAMROD for that) and would prefer to be compliant with regulations. It appears, though, that to be compliant, I can't climb Little Tahoma, unless I wait until October.

Is there someone I should specifically I should call if I want to discuss the possibility of "self-registering" for a one-day climb?

How about your cell phone, Mike? You could get "Alpine Buddy of the week" for sure if you gave us that!

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quote:

Originally posted by Government Watch Dog:

...And to limit your paranoia boys and girls,

Oh my god, the Feds are trying to limit our paranoia! It's a conspiracy!

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Wow...I stand corrected. The RMI people gave me that info last year, even though I told them I was a private climber.

 

Thanks for clearing that up Mike.

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stefan

 

1. yes, you need a climbing permit for little t, even if you do it in a day. you wont have to hassle with getting a campsite, but you still need to register.

 

2. you don't need to register for 1 day ascents like the one your mentioned, or in other areas like the tatoosh.

 

mike

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Questions for Mike Gauthier!!!

 

1) Are climbing permits only required for climbs when you exceed 10,000 feet? That would include Little Tahoma even for a day?

 

2) If I arrive before the gate attendant is on duty and climb Cowlitz Chimneys in a day do I have to have any backcountry permits? Parking permits?

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