Dechristo Posted February 3, 2006 Share Posted February 3, 2006 I thought this quote from the linked website deserves space, in case folks don't hit the link: Please concentrate your buying on Arla Foods products. That's the Danish company mostly hit by the boycott here due to her extensive business dealings in the Gulf area. Some people might ask me why I am doing this? Why I am swimming against the tide? I'm doing this because two things raise my temper: a baby screaming and childish acts. I consider this boycott one of the most childish things I've ever seen. An INDEPENDENT, can you hear this word my fellow Arabs and Muslims, INDEPENDENT, newspaper published insulting cartoons of the prophet, what does Arla Foods, a company that employs thousands here, have to do with it??? OK you got your semi-apology (the paper did NOT apologize for the cartoons), are you happy now? Well, look what you've got along with this semi-apology from J-Posten. You managed to incite papers around Europe to publish the same cartoons, and you managed to convince billions of how childish you are and how unready you are to embrace the values of liberal democracy. You might be ready to throw a ballot in a ballot box and draw a grin on your face afterwards, yet you are NOT ready to embrace the values of an open free system that will give the right to idiots such as J-Posten to publish stuff you don't like. Grow up, pleeeeeeeeeeeeease grow up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cobra_Commander Posted February 3, 2006 Share Posted February 3, 2006 how can anyone be angry at a quality Danish? they always make me happy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chucK Posted February 3, 2006 Share Posted February 3, 2006 Maybe I can take JayB's prize with this one Other people pissed off at another offensive cartoon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dechristo Posted February 3, 2006 Share Posted February 3, 2006 Maybe we can just build a big ass enclosed fence around Jerusalem, toss all the far right wing religious nutjobs of the christian, muslim, and jewish faith in there, lock the gates and let them have a battle royale to the death. With any luck, they would kill each other off and the sane people of the world could get on with our lives. You can bet there'd be survivors empowered by God's hand delivering them as victors over the enemies du jour. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayB Posted February 3, 2006 Share Posted February 3, 2006 Dru, the world gets a little too complicated if one takes their cultural blinders off. Word. Check out the Cultural Blinders on this guy: Big Pharaoh Umm, Jay, weren't you taking part in some random "buy Danish" campaign earlier? Hahaha. Way to connect the dots there, amigo. I actually just linked a random site for no reason at all. Certainly nothing on there that's germaine to the topic at hand. Keep plugging away on the "People who criticize violent mobs are the real Nazis" theme that you had going on earlier if you want to stay in first place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cj001f Posted February 3, 2006 Share Posted February 3, 2006 Hahaha. Way to connect the dots there, amigo. I actually just linked a random site for no reason at all. Certainly nothing on there that's germaine to the topic at hand. Keep plugging away on the "People who criticize violent mobs are the real Nazis" theme that you had going on earlier if you want to stay in first place. ohhhh.... I want to play the JayB random rightwing anger popomatic quote generator! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayB Posted February 3, 2006 Share Posted February 3, 2006 Maybe I can take JayB's prize with this one Other people pissed off at another offensive cartoon I knew I count count on you to put in a strong effort in this contest, Chuck. Death threats, cartoonists in hiding under protection and fearing for their lives, mobs massing outside of embassies, etc - and....letters to the editor expressing dissaproval. "Hey--now that I think about it....those *are* exactly alike." Hahaha. You are way out in front with that effort. How about arguing that the West has no grounds upon which to object to female genital mutilation upon so long as we permit cirumcision to continue? Might get you the title. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cj001f Posted February 3, 2006 Share Posted February 3, 2006 How about arguing that the West has no grounds upon which to object to female genital mutilation upon so long as we permit cirumcision to continue? Might get you the title. Do your own sample asking women which they prefer and you'll be pissed about the snip too. So what does JayB propose we do with these radical muslims? Convert them to "progressive" western ideals via......? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willstrickland Posted February 3, 2006 Share Posted February 3, 2006 You can bet there'd be survivors empowered by God's hand delivering them as victors over the enemies du jour. At least we'd know who's side God is really on afterwards, right? They all claim to possess the "true" faith. Lets see who emerges from Thunderdome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
underworld Posted February 3, 2006 Share Posted February 3, 2006 How about arguing that the West has no grounds upon which to object to female genital mutilation upon so long as we permit cirumcision to continue? Might get you the title. Do your own sample asking women which they prefer and you'll be pissed about the snip too. not enough left over? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cj001f Posted February 3, 2006 Share Posted February 3, 2006 You can bet there'd be survivors empowered by God's hand delivering them as victors over the enemies du jour. At least we'd know who's side God is really on afterwards, right? They all claim to possess the "true" faith. Lets see who emerges from Thunderdome. I always thought it was who the others smote first that'd be the true winner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cj001f Posted February 3, 2006 Share Posted February 3, 2006 How about arguing that the West has no grounds upon which to object to female genital mutilation upon so long as we permit cirumcision to continue? Might get you the title. Do your own sample asking women which they prefer and you'll be pissed about the snip too. not enough left over? Who knew that curtains were a performance accesory? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chucK Posted February 3, 2006 Share Posted February 3, 2006 We could restrict these protests to "free-speech zones". That would probably solve all this. Hmm, but what to do about all these nasty boycotts...sort of a freedom of the market issue there. Guess we'll just make fun of them... What exactly is the controversial issue here anyway? Death threats over cartoons bad? Protesting over slights to your religion bad? Religious fundamentalists should lighten the fuck up? Which one of these points are we debating? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cj001f Posted February 3, 2006 Share Posted February 3, 2006 What exactly is the controversial issue here anyway? Death threats over cartoons bad? Protesting over slights to your religion bad? Religious fundamentalists should lighten the fuck up? Which one of these points are we debating? That would be d) JayB likes to make fun of lefties Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chucK Posted February 3, 2006 Share Posted February 3, 2006 I think this avatar image rocks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willstrickland Posted February 3, 2006 Share Posted February 3, 2006 Should censorship ever be applied to political cartoons on ANY basis? That is the only issue I see here. My answer is absolutely not. Not for any reason. No "harming the morale of our troops" canards, no "offending my religious sensibilities" pearl clutching, no "lowers the discourse" misdirects. Free speech period. I might not like what you say, but I'll defend your right to say it, write it, draw it, or sing it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattp Posted February 3, 2006 Share Posted February 3, 2006 I think we could come up with LOTS of potential political cartoons I'd censor, if you make it crude/hateful/incendiary enough but I generally agree with your principal of granting wide latitude to political expression, Will. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dru Posted February 3, 2006 Share Posted February 3, 2006 I think we could come up with LOTS ... I'd censor, . ...like any discussion of illegal power drilling by WCC members in designated wilderness, maybe? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marylou Posted February 3, 2006 Share Posted February 3, 2006 Convert them to "progressive" western ideals via......? force. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cj001f Posted February 3, 2006 Share Posted February 3, 2006 We could restrict these protests to "free-speech zones". That would probably solve all this. Fox News says a new provision slipped into the Patriot Act by Arlen Specter, the Pennsylvania Republican, would give the Secret Service virtually unchecked authority to make felony arrests of demonstrators inside a security perimeter at any 'special event of national significance,' even when the star of the show -- like Bush or Cheney -- isn't present. This would apply at any designated 'National Security Special Events,' even when the president is dead [Ronald Reagan's funeral procession] or not there [the Super Bowl.] What as once ranked as misdemeanor trespassing would be elevated to a federal felony. This is on top of FAA flight restrictions dictating that private pilots can't fly above Cheney's new Chesapeake Bay neighborhood even when the VP isn't home." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayB Posted February 3, 2006 Share Posted February 3, 2006 How about arguing that the West has no grounds upon which to object to female genital mutilation upon so long as we permit cirumcision to continue? Might get you the title. Do your own sample asking women which they prefer and you'll be pissed about the snip too. So what does JayB propose we do with these radical muslims? Convert them to "progressive" western ideals via......? Just sending a simple message that using threats of targeted and indiscriminate violence against anyone who in a Western democracy who is behaving in a way that is not consistent with their understanding of what is permitted under Islam is not going to succeed would suffice. Nice use of the scare quotes BTW. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cj001f Posted February 3, 2006 Share Posted February 3, 2006 Just sending a simple message that using threats of targeted and indiscriminate violence against anyone who in a Western democracy who is behaving in a way that is not consistent with their understanding of what is permitted under Islam is not going to succeed would suffice. Nice use of the scare quotes BTW. Nice use of indiscriminate to sidestep dealing with the antiabortion murderers our President sides with! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayB Posted February 3, 2006 Share Posted February 3, 2006 Convert them to "progressive" western ideals via......? force. Third place for this entry. Refusing to engage in self-censorship in response to threats and mobs and...conversion by force. Yeah, I see the connection... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sexual_chocolate Posted February 4, 2006 Share Posted February 4, 2006 (edited) Just sending a simple message that using threats of targeted and indiscriminate violence against anyone who in a Western democracy who is behaving in a way that is not consistent with their understanding of what is permitted under Islam is not going to succeed would suffice. I don't think many would disagree with this in principle, although what the "message" might consist of might be defined more concretely by the above advocate.... Is it really a surprise to anyone the reaction we see regarding the cartoons in question? We are already dealing with a cultural/religious/political rift between the "west" and Muslim peoples; certainly denigrating both the supreme spiritual entity/symbol AND the followers of that entity/symbol in one fell swoop will inflame the passions in a most predictable way! I'm surprised anyone would be startled by this. To understand this is in no way an endorsement of the violence advocated by the "protesters"; I think the principles of democracy and freedom of speech must be protected and served. But I think that a little bit of humility might serve the situation better (as leading politicians in most countries have done), instead of a self-righteous display of western values flag-waving. Just my 2 cents. Edited February 4, 2006 by sexual_chocolate Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayB Posted February 6, 2006 Share Posted February 6, 2006 There's still time for more entries, but in the meantime I thought I'd post something from the anonymous Saudi Blogger behind "The Religious Policeman's Blog." Great Stuff. (http://muttawa.blogspot.com/) "Another Memo From: Royal Press Secretary To: His Majesty Date: 4th February 2006 Subject: Cartoons I was perhaps too pessimistic at the end of my previous memo. Things have in fact turned out better than we might have expected. As I reported, a number of other European newspapers did publish the cartoons. In two of those cases, the owners of those papers sacked the offending editors, thus demonstrating that jobs are at risk when we Muslims are offended! This, I am sure, is a lesson that will not have been lost on other editors. It is noticeable now that with a few striking exceptions, such as those very aggressive Germans, newspapers and broadcasters are very reluctant to show them further, and they appear not to have been shown at all in the USA. What is also very gratifying is that officials in the West are not only accepting our right to be offended at whatever we choose, but they are also saying that the Western media should work to our standards, not theirs. It is striking how soon they forget about their self-professed "freedoms" when they witness a little righteous Muslim anger. Thus UK Foreign Secretary Straw's comment.... Mr Straw said the decision by some European newspapers to print the cartoons was "disrespectful" and he added that freedom of speech did not mean an "open season" on religious taboos. ....or to paraphrase him, "having a freedom does not mean that you have the right to use it". We could not have put it better ourselves; perhaps we should ask Mr Straw to write editorials for the "Arab News"! The US State Department, on the other hand, persists in proclaiming kuffar values.... Our response is to say that while we certainly don’t agree with, support, or in some cases, we condemn the views that are aired in public that are published in media organizations around the world, we, at the same time, defend the right of those individuals to express their views. ....however the US is overall becoming a bit of a problem to which I shall refer later. Generally, active Muslims around the world have reacted well to our lead. As well as the unemployed "usual suspects" in Palestine and Indonesia, some British Muslims gave a particularly impressive display yesterday. The official reaction of British officialdom - precisely nothing! - illustrates how successful we have been over the years in getting them to accept the "Principle of Asymmetry". In other words, we use their sense of "fair play", "multiculturalism", "democratic values", and of course their guilt feelings, against them, so that they restrict their own freedom of action, but are very lax when dealing with the Muslim, for fear of offense or violent reaction. This of course confuses and demoralizes the ordinary person-in-the-street, and weakens their resistance to the onward march of the Ummah. May I just say, Your Majesty, how these events have demonstrated the wisdom of your decision to remind people about those old cartoons. The story has now developed a momentum of its own, it will run and run, and who remembers those pilgrims in Makkah? What pilgrims? Exactly! Not only that, but the Egyptians' poor maritime standards mean that a much larger death toll will now remain in the public eye. Your Majesty, could I just ask you to have a word with your brother Naif, and restrain his "initiative" while you are away on state visits? He seems to have taken it upon himself to try to move us up to MOL Condition Red, and get an apology from the Pope.* Saudi Interior Minister Prince Naif called on international religious institutions, especially the Vatican, to step into the developing row between Muslims and the European press over the publication of cartoons insulting the Prophet and condemn these actions. This was premature and ill-judged, particularly as Pope Benedict has an unfortunate reputation for following his own counsel, is not a known admirer of Islam, and was unlikely to respond. This necessitated some panic behind the scenes to get a Vatican response. A Vatican cardinal Friday condemned the cartoons in European newspapers, saying satire that offended groups and their most sacred symbols was abusive. Cardinal Achille Silvestrini, a retired Vatican diplomat who has had many dealings with Arab countries, told an Italian newspaper that Western culture had to know its limits. Freedom is a great virtue but it must be shared and it must not be unilateral, said Silvestrini. But as the "Saudi Gazette" is forced to admit, he is in fact retired, being aged over 80 he was too old to elect the current Pope, and therefore his opinions carry as much official weight as those of a Rome taxi-driver. But such are the problems of finding spokesmen when Prince Naif goes off on his own without consulting this office. Another problem of course with going to Condition Red, is that President Bush is showing excessive independence these days. His recent speech about reducing the US's "Addiction to Oil" suggested that he would like to dissociate the US from us as quickly as technology will permit. This would be very bad for Saudi morale and we have suppressed reporting of this in the Saudi newspapers. Instead we have focussed on his predictable call for "Political reform", whatever that is, and generally ridiculed it. SAUDI political analysts have described the US President George W. Bush's call to Egypt and Saudi Arabia to expand political reform in his State of the Union address as personal and motivated by political objectives. Unfortunately the "Saudi Gazette" chose to quote some lecturer in Advanced Interrogation Techniques from our Police College. His speech about reform is nothing but a pressure tactic in an ambitious attempt for more political gains at a time when his popularity is dwindling, said Muhammad Al-Obaid, a professor at Naif Arab University of Security Studies. I have spoken to the SG about their poor choice of "expert". However, in spite of better quotes like this from two of your own appointees.... Members of the Shoura Council like Mohammad Al-Zulfa and Mohammad Ibrahim Al-Hulwah were quoted by agencies as saying that the Kingdom was initiating reforms of its own volition and Bush should stop acting as if he were the sole agent for reform in the world. ....we are nevertheless "treading on thin ice" when we talk about our reforms. Sooner or later someone is going to ask exactly what they are. Rather than change the subject at that time, I would rather take the initiative now and put pressure on the US. Therefore I would change my recommendation from my previous Memo. Rather than go after Belgium, I propose that we put them on "hold", and instead "suddenly discover" the blasphemous "South Park" "Super Best Friends" episode. Can I have Your Majesty's approval for this course of action? A. M. Al Shegri Press Secretary Royal Palace" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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