shallow snow avalanche?

[cj001f]

Seriously thanks for all the ideas to add to my though process.

Here are 2 - read an avy book. Take an Avy Class.

[Blakej]

I've done both but they still don't do a hell of a lot more than give you an idea of what your looking at its surviving the learning curb in the backcountry I'm trying to do. Most of the stuff you hear about in your basic avy class or read about doesn't always match up with the overall picture you experience in the backcountry. Atleast thats what I've found.

[MPaul_Hansen]

Shallow snow avalanche - different scenerio.....

Set off by traversing w/GS skiis [carefully] a 1" to 1.5" [YES - INCH] spring-time wet-snow slide starting at the very top/crest of the backside 'Seventh Heaven' of Cowboy Mtn - Stevens Pass. The long, sustained slope accumulated and accumulated the sun-soaked snow, gathering it so when it reached the valley floor [vicinity of Tunnel Crk, west of the pass] the slide debris was on the order of 8', more or less in depth [varied, due to terrain effects, channeling, etc.]

 

Some party members initially felt before descending, no precautions were necessary before cruising down the sustained slope. They were shocked and speechless on the way out to US-2, after seeing what happened...and what would have happened if anyone was trapped, as the slide set up like cement.

 

I guess one can not be too careful!

[mattp]

The main point anybody gets from a avalanche course is fear, Blake.

 

Don't seek to become an "expert" so you can ski or climb without worry. A few years back I read somewhere that the most common profile for a backcountry skier killed in an avalanche was a male, with several years' experience and avalanche training. Consider, too, the high incidence of fatality among avalanche professionals. These victims had a sense of mastery.

 

The fear, combined with a little bit of knowledge and some actual judgment, may keep you alive.

[KaskadskyjKozak]

Several years ago, I was skiing up on Granite Mountain in the Spring and got caught quite unaware of the hazard on a south facing slope where rocks and grass were showing through the surface in such profusion that I had no idea there was anything that could slab.

 

Granite Mountain is notorious for slides on the gully I think you are referring to. At least it is mentioned in the guidebooks.

 

I'd recommended looking for such information in guidebooks, or route descriptions (or talking to a Ranger or someone knowledgable about the area). This does NOT replace independent avalanche evaluation on-site, but can complement this analysis, or even rule out a certain route depending on recent weather patterns.

[thelawgoddess]

At this time of year, I really like to know what is under the snow, 2-3 feet of snow on top of a grassy slope is a lot more of a hazard than 2-3 on top of a field of large talus. The underlying "texture" can make a big difference to how well things are anchored.

the surface on which the snow lies is very important. and it can sometimes take a while for unstable snow to build up and become compacted and more stable. i would definitely expect early season slides on smooth surfaces and from layers sitting on top of looser ones.

[Chad_A]

The main point anybody gets from a avalanche course is fear, Blake.

 

Don't seek to become an "expert" so you can ski or climb without worry. A few years back I read somewhere that the most common profile for a backcountry skier killed in an avalanche was a male, with several years' experience and avalanche training. Consider, too, the high incidence of fatality among avalanche professionals. These victims had a sense of mastery.

 

The fear, combined with a little bit of knowledge and some actual judgment, may keep you alive.

 

True, true. I took a class with NCMG; if I remember correctly, the most common person to be killed in an avalanche is a 20-30 year old male, with a basic avalanche course under his belt. Guess that, sometimes, a little information is just enough to make you feel less vulnerable.

[selkirk]

The main point anybody gets from a avalanche course is fear, Blake.

 

Don't seek to become an "expert" so you can ski or climb without worry. A few years back I read somewhere that the most common profile for a backcountry skier killed in an avalanche was a male, with several years' experience and avalanche training. Consider, too, the high incidence of fatality among avalanche professionals. These victims had a sense of mastery.

 

The fear, combined with a little bit of knowledge and some actual judgment, may keep you alive.

 

True, true. I took a class with NCMG; if I remember correctly, the most common person to be killed in an avalanche is a 20-30 year old male, with a basic avalanche course under his belt. Guess that, sometimes, a little information is just enough to make you feel less vulnerable.

 

I've heard that statistic over and over, and always wondered if it actually had little to do with the training, and more to do with the amount of time spent out in the backcountry? Anyone have statistics for number of avalanche victims, vs time spend in the backcountry per year, to compare the level of training statistics to?

[snoboy]

Good reading on this very issue over at www.snowpit.com

 

Ian McCammon has written a paper looking into this and it can be downloaded as a .pdf here.

[treknclime]

A ground release isn't all that uncommon, and can happen at a variety of depths...and it's more common in the rockies (caused from cold clear nights)... or around here after rising snow levels and some rain. The snowpack is heated at the earth (or moisture is sublimated from colder airtemps above the snowpack), causing faceting...otherwise known as rotten snow--a weakness in bonding is created between the snow and ground. Something certainly to be careful around when you notice deep grainy snow with big crystals near the ground, rocks, trees, or other "heat sinks." That's my understand of things, anyhow.

[Gary_Yngve]

Several years ago, I was skiing up on Granite Mountain in the Spring and got caught quite unaware of the hazard on a south facing slope where rocks and grass were showing through the surface in such profusion that I had no idea there was anything that could slab.

 

Granite Mountain is notorious for slides on the gully I think you are referring to. At least it is mentioned in the guidebooks.

 

I'd recommended looking for such information in guidebooks, or route descriptions (or talking to a Ranger or someone knowledgable about the area). This does NOT replace independent avalanche evaluation on-site, but can complement this analysis, or even rule out a certain route depending on recent weather patterns.

 

Woah, KK the Newbie is trying to give advice to the dude who has backcountry skiied for over 20 years.