Dru Posted July 9, 2004 Share Posted July 9, 2004 Wayne - there are several Grade VII's in North America - all are big wall climbs on Baffin Island. "THE" traverse of the Waddington summits plus Combatant, Tiedemann, Asperity, Serra V, Serra IV, Serra III, Serra II and Serra I, is only given a Grade VI. are you saying the pickets traverse is significantly more serious than that? I am not starting an argument. I am merely pointing out hyperbole. I would do the same if someone said that freeing Liberty Crack was 5.14, even though I haven't freed Lib crack. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshK Posted July 9, 2004 Author Share Posted July 9, 2004 so I was sorta under the impression that, despite the original intent, grade ratings were relative to other stuff in the area. It at least seems it has become that way. There are grade 5s to compare to, such as the tomrmet-forbidden traverse. Obviously a traverse of either picket range is way more committing and difficult than torment forbidden, both technically and physical. So here is my real question...are there any grade 6s established in the cascades? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Der_Wanderer Posted July 9, 2004 Share Posted July 9, 2004 Kick axe trip and report, y'all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dberdinka Posted July 9, 2004 Share Posted July 9, 2004 There are grade 5s to compare to, such as the tomrmet-forbidden traverse. I think grades in the PNW are a little on the soft side. The T-F traverse might take a while but it's technically unchallenging and just not that severe. Grade IV seems a LOT more reasonable. Same with other "Grade V's" like NE Buttress of Slesse and Clean-Break. Both these routes are regularly done in a day by moderate climbers and offer ~10 pitches of 5.7 -to- 5.10- climbing. Isn't a Grade V supposed to be two full days of technically challenging climbing? were as a Grade IV is one FULL day of technically challenging climbing? I imagine N Norweigan Buttress and The Diamond on Bear Peak are honest to goodness Grave VIs but I sure couldn't tell yah! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dru Posted July 9, 2004 Share Posted July 9, 2004 real honest grade VI's would also include the east face of slesse. i would have to call the NE butt of slesse a V but right at the bottom end of the scale. the east butt direct, nav wall and real mckim would also be V's, all are harder and more sustained tho than the ne butt. otoh routes like the SE butt or flight 810 would be IV's Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forrest_m Posted July 9, 2004 Share Posted July 9, 2004 wayne - sorry, not to derail this fascinating debate about ratings, but to answer your question about what we did in '99, i'm rather disappointed to report that i have spent 5 years thinking that we (dan aylward, marshall balick, tim matsui and i) climbed the snow couloir to the ghost-crooked thumb notch and then traversed towards challenger, when in fact it is now clear that we climbed the snow couloir to the crooked thumb-challenger notch. (the error stems from the mis-label in the previous edition of the beckey guide, an error perpetuated in my memory). this error seemed logical at the time, since as you note, the ridge is very long and has numerous sub-summits which are believable as independent summits when seen from the ridge crest. nor did we actually summit challenger on that traverse, instead we descended a couloir on the west side about 3/4 of the way along in rain and lightning. so any webbing you found south of the CT-C col belongs to someone else. the only other summit we reached on that trip was luna peak - not much payoff for hauling 90 pound packs into the area! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshK Posted July 10, 2004 Author Share Posted July 10, 2004 Forest, I'm upset you interrupted that fascinating ratings debate. It's really easy to see how people could get all the summits and subsummits confused on the ridge. The summits themselves dont rise all that high above the rest of the ridge, but more importantly, the sheer number of subsummits make telling them all apart quite difficult. Only by being on the ridge and looking back on it right after getting off it did it at all make sense... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benk Posted July 28, 2004 Share Posted July 28, 2004 Fun time Josh and Wayne ... done in a great NW style! Well written too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eternalX Posted July 31, 2004 Share Posted July 31, 2004 Do you think that you could skip the sketchy traverse if you skipped crooked thumb and went directly towards Luna Lake? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshK Posted August 1, 2004 Author Share Posted August 1, 2004 Do you think that you could skip the sketchy traverse if you skipped crooked thumb and went directly towards Luna Lake? You mean straight from Challenger to Luna lake? Well, yes, there is a route that goes that way, but it wouldn't be at all related to the ridge traverse we did, which we did on purpose. We weren't just lost on our way to Luna. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eternalX Posted August 1, 2004 Share Posted August 1, 2004 Do you think that you could skip the sketchy traverse if you skipped crooked thumb and went directly towards Luna Lake? You mean straight from Challenger to Luna lake? Well, yes, there is a route that goes that way, but it wouldn't be at all related to the ridge traverse we did, which we did on purpose. We weren't just lost on our way to Luna. Well right. I wasn't implying you were lost. I'm planning on doing a trip later this month to hit Challenger and Luna and I don't think I want to do that skethcy traverse. Just seeing what the options were. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshK Posted August 1, 2004 Author Share Posted August 1, 2004 Yes, LIke I said, there is a way. You may want to find specific beta since I am not sure what the recommended route is. the "sketchy" traverse is very technical, and exposed, climbing. It isn't a way to get from one place to another for certain, unless you are specifically wanting to be on that ridge Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carversprint Posted August 27, 2005 Share Posted August 27, 2005 Great pics and TR Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blake Posted August 27, 2005 Share Posted August 27, 2005 Wow, i didn't realize wayne and josh had huge Picket trips in Back-to-BAck years. nice (re)read Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wayne Posted August 27, 2005 Share Posted August 27, 2005 4 trips to the Pickets , 16 days, 32 summits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fourteenfour Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 excellent TR….I really need to get to the Pickets. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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