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fenderfour

Icicle Canyon 4/24-25

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The Mountaineers and the Boealpers will be descending on Icicle Canyon like flies on shit (I will be one of them). I don't know what crags or what days, but you can rest assured that we will be there, gapin up the scene.

 

sorry folks.

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fenderfour

 

I was planning on taking some semi-climbing friends to Barney's Rubble and Bruce's Boulder this weekend, but it looks like the Mounties will be gapin up the scene. Any other suggestions for good TR routes for beginners? I was thinking about Domestic Dome. It has a few easier (or is it moderate?) 5.6 to 5.9 routes.

 

-spanks y'all.

 

BTW - if you are out there this weekend look for me. I'm the tall (6'3") gaper with a red beard and piercings. You can find me at the Eightmile campground. Just look for the Green Subaru Outback with an obnoxious amount of climbing stickers on it.

 

thanks fer da warning, fender

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Last weekend in the Icicle a Boealp guy mentioned they 'reserved' Mountaineers dome for the weekend of 24/25. I wondered alound how one reserves a rock and where I could go to get such a reservation. He explained they had not really reserved it, they just string ropes all over the place.

 

Now this practice has never really bothered me much as I never climbed at the beginners areas except for soloing. (I never realized I might have offended folks' sensibilities). But now that my wife is climbing, I like to take her on easier climbs.

 

So all of you Boealps and Mountaineers should know this: You have every right to string top ropes where you want to. You even have the right to tie up a crag all freaking weekend. However, leading takes priority over top roping. So if someone wants to lead through your top rope, be nice about it and step aside. Don't pull any 'we have a class bullshit', or 'we reserved this crag' or 'we were here first'. I don't care, none of that matters. What matters is that I lead, and you don't so get out of my way.

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I'm not real pleased with the way that the Boealps take over crags for classes, but the powers that be seem to think that there is no other way to teach a class.

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I've never read this "leading takes priority" rule anywhere but here on cc.com. Is it in "The Freedom of the Hills?" One of John Long's books?

 

Really, Dan. I understand the sentiment. It is just plain rude for any group to think they can "reserve" or "tie up" a crag, but I'm just not sure about your "rule." It seems to me that a little bit of consideration and flexibility should be employed on all parts, whether they are leading or not. Just because you can "lead through" on some 5.4 crack and some other gaper can't, you have right to lead through but that other gaper has to wait until the Mounties are gone on Monday morning? I don't think so.

 

By the way. It may be a pain in the neck, but I am pretty sure you can find some "beginner's routes" in Leavenworth that will not be overtaken by instructional groups if you don't want to be around them. Try anything that actually requires leading, like Castle Rock if you don't want to hike very far, or head for a crag more than 300 yards from the road. You should be fine. I realize that Mountie's Buttress and Barnie's Rubble are convenient and you've probably got them all dialed in after soloing there a 100 times, but there ARE other alternatives.

 

I'm not trying to pick a fight with you, Dan, but I DO think Icicle Creek is a great place for Boealps and the Mounties and just because you have your own program I don't think you or I or anybody else take priority over them.

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Fenderfour,

I understand why they would think they have to "tie up" a crag. However, if they do, and if somebody gets mad about it, it'll be their own fault. This kind of selfish behavior can lead to problems that we really don't need and it certainly fuels the jokes about Mounties and Boealps because other climbers come to dislike the mere presence of such organizational groups. I hope their instructor's training includes not only a discussion of minimizing their impact on where they climb, but also minimizing their impact on other climbers who are there at the same time.

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I've never read this "leading takes priority" rule anywhere but here on cc.com. Is it in "The Freedom of the Hills?" One of John Long's books?

I do believe that I have read this in a book. I'm not exactly sure which book, maybe Smith Rock Guide, or Modern Rock Climbing by Todd Skinner. That's not to say that it stands any more because it's actually been published, just that maybe it's more universally recognized by the climbing community.

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I made the rule up. You read it here first. Feel free to quote me.

 

'Excuse me Mr Mountie, but you must step aside as I am leading and you are merely following. I'm sure you've read the Book of Dan.'

 

'Why yes of course, lead on through my good man.'

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Nobody can "reserve" a crag. That is utter nonsense. The Boealps are PLANNING to be at Mountaineer Dome on Sunday. They told me that anyone is welcome to show up and climb if they want. If there is a particular route you want to climb, mention it to them, even if there is already a top rope on it and I think they will accomodate you.

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I'm not exactly sure which book, maybe Smith Rock Guide, or Modern Rock Climbing by Todd Skinner.

 

Sport-wank bullshit. Figures. the_finger.gif

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i don't know about this mountaineers class or the boealps either. however, it seems like communication can solve a lot of problems.

 

i get annoyed when i start climbing somewhere and a group comes along and takes over the area. h/e, as the group i encountered this w/e demonstrated, if you ask politely they'll usually find a way to accomodate you.

 

the part i hate is that you have to deal w/that for every route in the area you want to climb. a hassle so i usually move on. the reality though is that if you want to climb their most groups are accomodating. if they're not then they suck and deserve a good tongue lashing tongue.gif

 

so in short, quit whining, go climbing, and deal w/whatever you encounter.

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Sport-wank bullshit. Figures.

You might be right, this could just be the norm at certain crags, be them sport or not. This is kinda nice, I need to start quoting myself more often.

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Mounties!!!!!!!!!!

I sheet and peese all over you!

You vile swarm of polypro and waterproof-breathable nametag helmet outer shell mitt gaitor dung.

45 yo fat asses have no business learning to climb trad - find something else to brag about at work.

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i don't know about this mountaineers class or the boealps either. however, it seems like communication can solve a lot of problems.

 

i get annoyed when i start climbing somewhere and a group comes along and takes over the area. h/e, as the group i encountered this w/e demonstrated, if you ask politely they'll usually find a way to accomodate you.

 

the part i hate is that you have to deal w/that for every route in the area you want to climb. a hassle so i usually move on. the reality though is that if you want to climb their most groups are accomodating. if they're not then they suck and deserve a good tongue lashing tongue.gif

 

so in short, quit whining, go climbing, and deal w/whatever you encounter.

 

 

 

i have soem of the same issues, i hate hostile group take overs, and it is hostile when a group of 20 or so people come to tr a handful of climbs and in alot of cases crowd out some of the better but harder climbs, kinda like the sportos that crowd out all the good crack climbs on sunshine wall. madgo_ron.gif

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Every year we have these complaints when the mounties or boealps teaches their classes. It's getting boring. How do you think non-cc.com people feel when we take over Smith or L'worth for one of our rope-ups or lovefests? We string up top ropes, climb as big groups, all in the name of being social and having a good time.

 

News flash, it's a crag. There will be other people. Did all of you learn how to lead or perform self-rescue from a book or did you take a class somewhere? At least they aren't stringing fixed lines up the South Arete on SEWS and not letting anyone pass.

 

My understanding is that there are only a couple weekends a year that the Boealps intermediate class "takes over" a crag. Primarily to teach the very basics of leading and rock rescue. Unlike some other climing orgs, they have a one-to-one ratio of instructors to students, so pretty much every other weekend during the class they are climbing in pairs or as 2 groups of two.

 

I think it is sad when people on either side can just communicate around the issues so everyone can have a good time out there. No one is entitled to climb anywhere.

 

Dan, if you want to climb at Mountaineers Dome this w/e get up and do it before 7 am and I'm sure you'll have the whole place to yourself for an hour or so.

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I did teach myself to climb by reading a book. I have never taken a class.

 

The Mountaineers rolled out of camp at precisely 6:30 AM, not unlike Patton's 3rd army, to over run the pracice cliffs. By 7:00 the devestation was complete. Unfortunately, the Mountaineers/Boealps did not recieve the news flash that there are other climbers. They seem to think they are the only ones.

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I have learned from books and from classes (very small ones). It is unfortunate if climbing clubs believe they are any more entitled to climb somewhere. I have encountered my share of rude mounties out there, more when I was a newbie and climbing easier routes. I know a few of the intructors for the Boealps and they are nice guys and I'd hope wouldn't give off the same vibe I've encountered out there on crowded days.

 

Have fun climbing this weekend everybody.

wave.gif

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Those f88kin mounties must really like Squamish, because everytime I go up there, there are topropes strung up all over Neat and Cool and Burgers and Fries. F88KIN MOUNTIES!!!! madgo_ron.gif

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I did teach myself to climb by reading a book. I have never taken a class.

 

The Mountaineers rolled out of camp at precisely 6:30 AM, not unlike Patton's 3rd army, to over run the pracice cliffs. By 7:00 the devestation was complete. Unfortunately, the Mountaineers/Boealps did not recieve the news flash that there are other climbers. They seem to think they are the only ones.

 

Actually, they are warning you where they will be BECAUSE they relize that they are not the only climbers. "reserved" is a poor choice of words, instead they should say that the plan to be there with a lot of peopl.

 

If some climbers happen to show up, of course they shouldn't be hassled if they want to jump on routes where the class has set up top ropes... and it's courteous to ask before you jump on lead where a toprope is set. (this is no different from any other interaction between climbers at the crags)

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THey where on EVERTHING on sat and sunday. overrunning everthing.. Did anyone find a set of slings on the archors and bobs boulder, 2 blue slings and 6 biners..

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THey where on EVERTHING on sat and sunday. overrunning everthing.. Did anyone find a set of slings on the archors and bobs boulder, 2 blue slings and 6 biners..

 

Where is "Bob's Boulder"? Do you mean perhaps Bruce's Boulder? or B.O.B. wall? And yes, the "aspirants" were everywhere! cantfocus.gif

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