Ryan Posted February 25, 2004 Share Posted February 25, 2004 Is there anyone that actually likes these screws? I received two of them for Christmas, and upon using them, I've found that unless the ice is absolutely perfect (plastic and FAT) they are a bitch to place, provided you can even get them started. I used them in somewhat brittle ice, and all they did was fracture the ice in every direction around the attempted placement, causing the ice to plate off, leaving me frustrated. BD screws worked fine in the same ice. Any thoughts on OP screws? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dru Posted February 25, 2004 Share Posted February 25, 2004 i have a bunch of the smileys but none of the op. maybe they went downhill. Â try starting them in a pick-hole instead of in untouched ice? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan Posted February 25, 2004 Author Share Posted February 25, 2004 Yeah, I hacked out a few holes and went for it, it helped a little bit, but when I'm sketching out way above my last screw on steep ice the last thing I need is that damn screw laughing in my face. They work alright once they're started- I must be too spoiled by how easy the BD screws are to use. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dru Posted February 25, 2004 Share Posted February 25, 2004 in general i would just pay the extra for the BD but the Smileys were OK for WI3 and on a dirtbag budget. i don't like the grinder knob though cause i heard a rumor (it has been debated here and elsewhere in the past) that because it never folds down, it can make the biner accidentally unclip from the screw in some strange fashion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan Posted February 25, 2004 Author Share Posted February 25, 2004 Hmm...interesting. The one thing I do like about the OP screws are the fact that the hanger is pretty big compared to the BD screws. It makes it super easy to clip, but the claim that you can clip two biners into the hanger, although true, seems a bit fucked, becuase one of the biners ends up resting on the other one- doesn't seem too practical in my mind. I'll just stick with BD. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OlympicMtnBoy Posted February 25, 2004 Share Posted February 25, 2004 Granted, I just started leading ice this season so I haven't climbed in a lot of different conditions, but I think my OP scews are ok. They're not nearly as nice to place as BD's but no one said they would be. They're not the hardest to place by any means either. At $25 a piece on gearexpress.com they're a bargain if you're looking to build up your rack. If you're climbing at your limit and want THE fastest, easiest to place screw then you get what you pay for, and OP probably isn't it. I think they're all right screws overall. The knob does help a bit in placing them although I've heard that it can get in the way, haven't seen it as being a problem in most situations. I haven't noticed any more fracturing with them than with my BD screw (yes, I only own one right now). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wopper Posted February 25, 2004 Share Posted February 25, 2004 The problem with OP screws is that they are manufactured by prison labor that is not allowed to unionize. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbw1966 Posted February 25, 2004 Share Posted February 25, 2004 The problem with OP screws is that they are manufactured by prison labor that is not allowed to unionize. Â Not allowed to unionize? They're in PRISON fer crissakes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan Posted February 25, 2004 Author Share Posted February 25, 2004 Olympic, that is a good point. I'm all about speed, though, so that's why I'm sticking with BD. The grinder knob on the OP screws is nice to have, though. I'll hang on to the two I have for placements that don't need to be made pronto. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulB Posted February 25, 2004 Share Posted February 25, 2004 My rack is made up of 9 Smiley screws and 1 BD stubby. I have the "grinder" on two of the Smileys. I've used them in all kinds of ice up to grade 5 without any problems. I bought most of them just after BD sold their factory to Smiley, so perhaps as Dru says, the quality has gone downhill. Â To the best of my knowledge, the original Smiley (formerly BD) factory did not use prison labour to make screws. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OlympicMtnBoy Posted February 25, 2004 Share Posted February 25, 2004 Off the main topic, but check out http://www.omegapac.com/inmate.html if you're concerned about OP's use of prison labor. I've never found fault with the quality of their gear, and no, I don't work for them. :-) The next screws I get will probably be BDs as I start leading more towards my limit, but I like my OPs and they got me out leading this season instead of sitting at home fondling my two BD screws wishing I had enough to lead a decent pitch. :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBay Posted February 25, 2004 Share Posted February 25, 2004 huh? spent some time in the canadian rockies this month. I had the opporitunity to climb with OP gear along with my well trusted BD gear. contrary to stereotypical beliefs (i.e., OP product is like unto REI quality, therefore OP=REI=Shit)and the cons presented in ClimbingMag ice screw review, we tended to rely more on OP screws when the situation required the 'one-shot-to-get-it-right-cuz-i'm-flamin'-placement.' Dru is right, before starting the placement of any ice screw one should shove it into a pick hole or chip/plate off the layer of 'magic shell'. i do think the OP screw is advantageous over the BD screw in starting the placement. the OP screw has a shorter lever arm, therefore reducing the 'wobble effect' at the start. My experience resulted in the confidence of reaching for an OP screw, stabbing the ice once, rocking it once to the right, and then grabbing the 'brodie-knob'to finish it off. On the otherhand, the BD screw has to be rocked back and forth a few times to seat it, and because of its lengthy lever arm with the 'brodie-knob' located at the end, there will be an increase in wobble effect if not seated good. faster one can get the screw in the less one has to hang on one arm and battle shrinking headspace. when called upon the OP screw does its job. in less-than-optimal ice, an OP screw held a 35 foot leader fall on the second pitch of Whoa Whoa Capitaine!. I'd say, buy the 4/$100 on gearexpress, spend some quality time at the base of some ice and practice a technique of placing a screw before hopping on the sharp end. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan Posted February 25, 2004 Author Share Posted February 25, 2004 I guess my experience was the exact opposite- the OP screw wobbled quite a bit, whereas the BD screw needed very little to get it started, allowing me to start grinding it in. It could be that I just need a bit more practice though... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wopper Posted February 26, 2004 Share Posted February 26, 2004 The problem with OP screws is that they are manufactured by prison labor that is not allowed to unionize. Â This was a tongue in cheek reference to an old, semi classic thread. Sorry that you did not get it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marylou Posted February 27, 2004 Share Posted February 27, 2004 And don't worry at all about YOUR job being outsourced to a nearby prison....that could NEVER happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dru Posted February 27, 2004 Share Posted February 27, 2004 silly, if they let prisoners make climbing gear they would climb over the walls with it and escape! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishstick Posted February 27, 2004 Share Posted February 27, 2004 I haven't used the OP, but my smileys have proven to be very close to a BD sans express knob. QC is at least equal.  Keep in mind a screw isn't going to engage until the side threads can draw it forward. Often the fastest way to create that opportunity is to punch an X shaped hole with the spike of your tool. Move upwards one move such that it’s a waist level, then go to work.  I really recommend practicing placing screws by bouldering. Get a couple of feet off the deck and fire in a bunch of screws. It’s great exercise and will help create confidence when you’re out there probing miles above your gear, knowing that sooner or later, you’ve got to plug something in.  Cheers,  GB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wopper Posted February 27, 2004 Share Posted February 27, 2004 And don't worry at all about YOUR job being outsourced to a nearby prison....that could NEVER happen. How long do you think it will take before convicts start managing construction projects? Maybe I will be eligible to get a federal grant to go back to school and be retrained. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbw1966 Posted February 27, 2004 Share Posted February 27, 2004 I read in the NYT that prisoners are being trained as police officers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David_Parker Posted February 27, 2004 Share Posted February 27, 2004 I haven't used the OP, but my smileys have proven to be very close to a BD sans express knob. Â I don't agree. I feel a significant difference with how much force it takes to put in a BD and a smiley/OP (same thing). I also don't like the not folding knob. Time (placing screw)is money and I wouldn't even consider buying an OP screw. Once you go BD, you won't go back. And I don't even have the newer BD's! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farrgo Posted March 1, 2004 Share Posted March 1, 2004 Ya, I've primarily used OP screws and when the ice is brittle and hard from lower temperatures it is really f'ing hard to get those things started. BD's seem to crank right in there even if I try and place them not right at my hip or with my left hand, there still easier than op's. I didn't believe the hype until I tried 'em, now I'm only gonna get BD's. Anybody want to buy some op's? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catbirdseat Posted March 1, 2004 Share Posted March 1, 2004 It seems to me that the ease of getting started has everything to do with how the teeth are cut and sharpened. If that is the case, one should be able to file the OP to make them more like the BD. After the screw is started, ease of turning has to do with the taper of the shaft on the inside and the finish of the metal, which is something about which nothing can be done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willstrickland Posted March 1, 2004 Share Posted March 1, 2004 Check your PMs masternate32. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dru Posted March 1, 2004 Share Posted March 1, 2004 It seems to me that the ease of getting started has everything to do with how the teeth are cut and sharpened. If that is the case, one should be able to file the OP to make them more like the BD. After the screw is started, ease of turning has to do with the taper of the shaft on the inside and the finish of the metal, which is something about which nothing can be done. Â how thick the wall is has nothing to do with it huh? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ade Posted March 1, 2004 Share Posted March 1, 2004 It seems to me that the ease of getting started has everything to do with how the teeth are cut and sharpened. If that is the case, one should be able to file the OP to make them more like the BD. After the screw is started, ease of turning has to do with the taper of the shaft on the inside and the finish of the metal, which is something about which nothing can be done. Â Just taking a BD screw and resharpening it requires some care. I wouldn't want to try and take an OP screw and try and change the angles etc on the teeth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.