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kweb

Single Wall Tents??

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Im looking at getting a single wall. Since I have never used one before, thought I'd ask.....are they worth it here in the PNW? Will be using it only on snow (Hood, Rainier, Daniel etc.) How about Garuda tents??

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I used a Bibler El Dorado at Camp Schurman during a sleet storm a couple of years ago..... held up great, no condensation, leaks, etc. Pricey, though, and the vestibule is sold separately.

[ 01-10-2002: Message edited by: jules ]

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I have used two brands, Garuda and Bibler. The Garuda was all right, but the Bibler rocks.

I own a Bibler I-Tent and it is the lightest strongest tent around (under 4 lbs.) Granted, it is small, but for the Cascades it rocks. It has ridden through a few mean storms and withstood some mean ass winds.

I look at it this way.

1. If is raining that hard, I am on the barstool or heading down for the barstool. The majority of the climbs in the Cascades are close to a road and thus a barstool. [big Drink] So if it is raining/sleeting that hard, I either have not gone into the hills or I am on my way out. A little bit of condensation....so what. You get that in any tent.

2. The majority of the climbs in the Cascades are one or two nighters....so I don't need that much room.

3. I travel light...so I don't need that much room.

4. I travel light...so I don't want to haul around a TNF VE-25. (12 lbs.+, no thanks)

5. There is sooomuch less bulk as well saving space in the old rucksack.

The only bad thing is that they are not cheap and very hard to even find on sale. Jules is right, the vestibules are seperate and even more money.

The Garuda had a lot of condensation when compared to the Bibler.

I have heard other say they do not like them...I love mine.

[ 01-10-2002: Message edited by: Rodchester ]

[ 01-10-2002: Message edited by: Rodchester ]

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I have the Garuda Kaja? It condenses inside less than I thought it would. It is ~7.5 lbs which is kind of heavy unless I am snow camping for a while and want an enclosed shelter. I rather a Megamid for most trips though. I like it but use it so little that I'd sell it and get a Megamid if I had a buyer. Interested? Its almost new and in perfect shape. 300.00?

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I have a single wall from Integral Designs. It was cheaper than the similar Bibler and is made out of the same stuff. Condensaiton is not a problem and I have to agree that the light weight (approx 4 lbs.) and small bulk are real attractive. The tent construction is bomber and Intrgarl Designs seems like a great company. I got mine from Jim Nelson at Pro Mountain Sports. Check out the various models. They are still expensive but a better value than the Bibler IMHO.

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I have used both garuda and bibler tents. My old garuda did not have taped seams so in a rain storm, water would seep through the seams and puddle up in the corners. Biblers have taped seams and have withstood many a bad storm. Unless garuda has changed their design as far as taped seams go, I would avoid them.

If you are staying in the cascades, there is no reason to get a big bibler. Get the eldo tent and forget the vestibule. If you need a vestibule, maybe you should be going home. How many cascade climbers have sat out a storm (probably lasting many days) then got the summit? Not many. The ones that did got it because they are dedicated and forgo the comforts. Anyhow, go enjoy.

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I use a I-tent and it works well for me. It is light and takes up little space in a pack. I have had no problems with condensation here in the PNW. I have sat out some pretty nasty thunder/lightning/wind storms with it on Rainier and it held up no problemo. I have used a Stephenson's Warmlite 2R also. It is lighter than the Bibler. It also collected a lot more condensation up in cold Alaska weather than the Bibler. Of course it's also not made of "breathable" material. If you want light weight though they are the way to go.

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I have a TNF Assault (similar to the Bibler I-tent) and at under 5 pounds with vestibule, it rocks in the snow. Condensation has never been an issue. I have sat through sleet, rain, and snow storms without getting the least bit wet. It sets up in minutes. (none of that interior pole crap) I recommend it highly and I generally do not like TNF products. Only problem is I bought it on the REI Outlet so TNF doesn't make it anymore. (cost me only $300!) Might find one used. I disagree with Gene about a vestibule, unless it's ridiculously heavy, it makes cooking or melting snow tolerable/doable in nasty wind storms... unless of course you cook in the tent. (I do not) You can always leave it home if your really trying to cut weight. (mine is just under a pound and takes up minimal space)

* Oh yeah, the HUGE TNF logo on both sides suck!

[ 01-10-2002: Message edited by: slaphappy ] shocked.gif" border="0

[ 01-10-2002: Message edited by: slaphappy ]

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OK, I'm giving another thumbs up to the Bibler (El Dorado OR I-tent). It is approx 4 lbs, and so I have carried it even when I don't have a tentmate. I don't know of any single-man tent that is as bomber as the Bibler two-man and weighs as little and feels like I'm sleepin' in a condo at camp (when I'm tent-mate-less).

[ 01-10-2002: Message edited by: jules ]

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I have an I-tent and a Fitzroy. They are great. The Fitz is 6 pounds w/o the vestibule and is bomber. I've been almost completely buried by blowing and drifting snow in it. Sleeps three in a pinch. I like the vestibules for cooking in the winter.

The I-tent is short. Two past climbing partners didn't fit in it at all. Definitely for the under six foot crowd.

They both set up very taut- like a drum. You have to be very careful around them with the shovel (learned that the hard way). BD/Bibler stands behind the 100%.

I took a year to make the decision to buy the first one. Kept trying to find something cheaper. Buying the second was a very easy decision. After all, how many times have you heard someone in the mountains say, "Damn, I wish I didn't have this really nice piece of gear."

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Here's something you might consider depending on your climbing interests.

Bibler makes a version of the I-tent that is designed to mate to a BD Double Skylounge portaledge. You can use it like a regular I tent and if you get that big-wall jones use it on the wall. Would save you money if you had to buy a ledge too because you wouldn't need to slap down for the fly. I know where you can get one for $485 (normally $685 for that version).

As for not wanting to carry a VE-25 I can dig that, that's why all my tents are sierra designs - lighter, bomber. I picked up a model year change stretch dome expedition 3-man a few years ago for around 40% off, it's probably bigger than the VE-25s and weighs in under 10lb. A 4lb tent would be pimpin'. Those Stevensons are crazy light, but also cost a fortune.

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As noted by others, the I-tent is for 6 foot and under...the Eldorado is longer...for the six foot and over crowd.

I am 6 foot and have the I-tent. Tight but no problem.

Also only get one door. The doors add way too much weight for the convience added. (Zippers are the heavy part)

Bibler I-tent....it rocks!!!! cool.gif" border="0

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check out Stephenson tents. They are the lightest yet are well regarded for their strength. Breathability? They use coated nylon which has a similar water-vapor transfer rate as Gore-tex, or Todd-tex, but is much more affordable. And the naked people in their old catalogs were a lot of fun (does anybody remember the centerfolds they had?)

www.warmlite.com

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I have used the Marmot and own a Bibler. The Bibler rocks. A complaint might be that the thing can be to warm in good summer weather.

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I'll toss in my $.02 (which adjusted for inflation equals nothing). I bought the bibler bombshelter for denali. My wallet was empty for montths after that one. Like someone else said though, you'll never complain about good gear on the mountains. At under 9lbs its pimpin for 2 and can sleep up to 4 in a pinch. I love bibler tents. I rarely use this thing anymore because its just overkill for the cascades.

One complaint: the floor is a bit flimsy. I poked a tent pole right through but Black Diamond repaired it and had it back to me in less than a week.

Condensation is never a problem. Set-up is easy, even solo in heavy winds.

Their expensive but worth it if you're seriously considering a single wall tent.

Garudas are too small for me (I am 6'3").

Rob

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Guilty as sin

I have the Eldorado two doors. but before BD took over (it seems that the quality control drop few notches lately).

As far as space, its cramp but, with the two doors its bearable. Also, I had never had any condensation in my tent (another reason to get the two doors), always bone dry from the humid NE to the dry NW. definitely worth the extra 6oz. for vestibule I have the Bibler vestibule that I never used. instead I use the Integral Design 4 X 6 silicon tarp (much more versatile piece of gear at about 5oz). it’s a bomber tent but don’t expect for too much from it in the durability department. its not as burly and durable as most double wall tents. I will get it as a specialized tent but first I will own a tough tent such as TNF mountain 25, Wild Country Quasar, Sierra Design Tiros with expedition fly to name a few.

anyway good luck to you with what you do

cool.gif" border="0

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OKAY!! I get the picture. Thanks to everyone for responding. I had to make a quick decision because there was a brand new Garuda tent on e-bay. I just picked it up for $250. I was looking at the I-tent but because my partner is 6'3" I quickly changed my mind. The way I read it, Bibler kicks ass but this Garuda tents carry weight is 5lbs. 11oz. and it has 31s.f. of floor space. And my behemith partner wont be touching the front and back walls.

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