AlpineK Posted March 9, 2003 Share Posted March 9, 2003 AlpenTom said: Yeah, those guys who like those long inconcise TRs don't have the balls to climb anything. We need to rid this site of this filth. On a serious note, good job on your ascent, and nice TR. Alpin Tom, you are missing the point. The above trip report was simple and easy to read. That means that 1 or 2 years down the road this trip report will be usefull information for other folks who might want to climb the NY gully. A long trip report that sounds like a story is great, but the author should go through 3 or 4 drafts before they post. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomcat Posted March 9, 2003 Share Posted March 9, 2003 My point is I like entertaining trip reports and am able to filter out the information I don't need. Your point is that you like short trip reports. That just sounds like a simple disagreement in opinions .. I don't think it has anything to do with me missing your point .. do you? Edited to say that bcollins was implying that those who have the balls to get up and do those things only write short, concise TRs so maybe you were missing my point AlpineK? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dru Posted March 9, 2003 Share Posted March 9, 2003 AlpenTom said: I guess we just disagree then. no no, dont say that!!! spectators demand a brawl! bread and circuses Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomcat Posted March 9, 2003 Share Posted March 9, 2003 damn .. I tried to edit it to make it sound better .. your DSL is keeping you on top of things! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlpineK Posted March 9, 2003 Author Share Posted March 9, 2003 If long trip reports were readable then they might be good, but a lot of the long ones on this site are totally unreadable. A short trip report shows respect for the reader. I think a lot, but not all, of the better climbers on this site try and keep it short because they know if someone is looking for beta then the bs is in the way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomcat Posted March 9, 2003 Share Posted March 9, 2003 Again, I disagree with the assessment that better climbers write shorter trip reports based upon the fact that the two are not related in the least. How do you know who some of the better climbers are on this site? How many people on this site have you climbed with to be able to make that assessment? Certainly you can't make that assessment by reading their TRs can you? I've read TRs from individuals who have well over 200 Cascade Summits that are long, detailed, and (to me) very entertaining. (Names not mentioned to protect the long trip report writers!) One certain individual I'm thinking of is most likely as good a climber as anyone on this site .. and far better than most. I only see a few people on this site voicing their disdain over the length of trip reports. I guess my only question would be how could you have enough time to make upwards of 1500 posts on this bulletin board (and spend countless more hours reading posts), yet still object to spending more time reading a "long" TR? How much more time could it take to sit there and sift out the stuff you're not interested in? Maybe 5 minutes at the most? You may have to sacrifice your next post in the Spray forum to do so, but we all know that climbing is all about making sacrifices. And as for the issue of respecting the reader, I disagree with that as well. I show respect to everyone (on the net and in person), but I write long trip reports and I don't feel I'm being disrespectful one bit by doing so. But I write my trip reports to share my entire experience with friend, family, and acquaintances, not merely to share facts about the climb that one could obtain from Beckey or other similar sources (or on their own by analyzing a topo map). Maybe I should start writing two trip reports .. one long TR and one short TR so I can write my TR how I see fit, yet not offend anyone at the same time. The way I see it, if I'm seeking beta for a climb and happen to stumble upon a trip report for that climb on the internet, then I feel pretty darn lucky to have someone taking the time to share information with me in the first place -- before the internet came around, climbers didn't have that luxury. If this reaches one more post, we're going to have to duke this out in Spray! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chucK Posted March 9, 2003 Share Posted March 9, 2003 (edited) Hey AlpenTom, You seem quite interested in prolonging this discussion. You're lucky AlpineK has stated his point once or twice so you can keep posting. As an example of what AK is talking about, let me quote your post above with how I read it AlpenTom said: Again, I disagree with the assessment that better climbers write shorter trip reports based upon the fact that the two are not related blah blah blah blah blah blah who some of the better climbers are on this site? How many people on this site have you climbed with to be able to make that assessment? Certainly you can't make that assessment by reading their TRs can you? ‹ÕWënÛ6þo ïpJ 0À’,YÒXšÄm¤—8ëº?%ÑJTH*Ž‹½ÈÞv‡¢dKmê6 0 0`‘‡äw.<7Žžõûp9}y1…w¯ e4aÊ3Y!`:~399C¿öFÏNÞO?LÆšLÀäêèüìHß÷ßïûþÉôþ:¾9‡¡7€©¢¹æ†Ëœ ß¿%@RcŠ¾¿X,¼ÅŽ'ÕÜŸ^øwkh×þiô“älWìE {½QÆ I only see a few people on this site ‹ÕWënÛ6þo ïpJ 0À’,YÒXšÄm¤—8ëº?%ÑJTH*Ž‹½ÈÞv‡¢dKmê6 0 0`‘‡äw.<7Žžõûp9}y1…w¯ e4aÊ3Y!`:~399C¿öFÏNÞO?LÆšLÀäêèüìHß÷ßïûþÉôþ:¾9‡¡7€©¢¹æ†Ëœ ß¿%@RcŠ¾¿X,¼ÅŽ'ÕÜŸ^øwkh×þiô“älWìE {½QÆ And as for the issue of respecting the reader,‹ÕWënÛ6þo ïpJ 0À’,YÒXšÄm¤—8ëº?%ÑJTH*Ž‹½ÈÞv‡¢dKmê6 0 0`‘‡äw.<7Žžõûp9}y1…w¯ e4aÊ3Y!`:~399C¿öFÏNÞO?LÆšLÀäêèüìHß÷ßïûþÉôþ:¾9‡¡7€©¢¹æ†Ëœ ß¿%@RcŠ¾¿X,¼ÅŽ'ÕÜŸ^øwkh×þiô“älWìE {½QÆ lah blah ‹ÕWënÛ6þo ïpJ 0À’,YÒXšÄm¤—8ëº?%ÑJTH*Ž‹½ÈÞv‡¢dKmê6 0 0`‘‡äw.<7Žžõûp9}y1…w¯ e4aÊ3Y!`:~399C¿öFÏNÞO?LÆšLÀäêèüìHß÷ßïûþÉôþ:¾9‡¡7€©¢¹æ†Ëœ ß¿%@RcŠ¾¿X,¼ÅŽ'ÕÜŸ^øwkh×þiô“älWìE {½QÆ The way I see it, ‹ÕWënÛ6þo ïpJ 0À’,YÒXšÄm¤—8ëº?%ÑJTH*Ž‹½ÈÞv‡¢dKmê6 0 0`‘‡äw.<7Žžõûp9}y1…w¯ e4aÊ3Y!`:~399C¿öFÏNÞO?LÆšLÀäêèüìHß÷ßïûþÉôþ:¾9‡¡7€©¢¹æ†Ëœ ß¿%@RcŠ¾¿X,¼ÅŽ'ÕÜŸ^øwkh×þiô“älWìE {½QÆ blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah have that luxury. ‹ÕWënÛ6þo ïpJ 0À’,YÒXšÄm¤—8ëº?%ÑJTH*Ž‹½ÈÞv‡¢dKmê6 0 0`‘‡äw.<7Žžõûp9}y1…w¯ e4aÊ3Y!`:~399C¿öFÏNÞO?LÆšLÀäêèüìHß÷ßïûþÉôþ:¾9‡¡7€©¢¹æ†Ëœ ß¿%@RcŠ¾¿X,¼ÅŽ'ÕÜŸ^øwkh×þiô“älWìE {½QÆ blah blah oh, and AlpineK probably does judge how good of climbers people are on this site by what they say they climbed. Edited March 9, 2003 by chucK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomcat Posted March 9, 2003 Share Posted March 9, 2003 Hey ChucK, by your logic this site is actually not a discussion forum, it's an argument forum. I do like to discuss and don't think others should be discouraged from writing TRs the way they see fit. Flame on brother man. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chucK Posted March 9, 2003 Share Posted March 9, 2003 OK, I fixed my post above to conform to your semantic specifications. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomcat Posted March 9, 2003 Share Posted March 9, 2003 Quit bumming my trip ChucK. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomcat Posted March 9, 2003 Share Posted March 9, 2003 I anxiously await your response in Spray so we can prolong this discussion even more. For example, why you're contesting my posts when you feel the same way? http://home.attbi.com/~cspieker/stories/chairtr.htm It's all about short and concise, right chucK? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chucK Posted March 9, 2003 Share Posted March 9, 2003 AlpenTom said: I anxiously await your response in Spray so we can prolong this discussion even more. I know Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dru Posted March 9, 2003 Share Posted March 9, 2003 (edited) Long TR from people that can write are good. Long TR full of illiteratisms and spelling mistakes, containing lotsa of useless info, misinformation, chestbeating and lies (my partner ate this for breakfast...his wife's name is Rochelle...i saw a cloud that looked like my mother in law...we drove from Everett to Index via the beautiful town of Concrete...in my opinion Ray Borbon is the worlds greatest climber for his stunning lead of R&D (IV 5.9)) are suck. If you can't write, don't write useless TRs pretending you can. If you can write feel free to write whatever you feel like writing. Edited March 9, 2003 by Dru Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomcat Posted March 10, 2003 Share Posted March 10, 2003 Dru .. I couldn't have said it any better myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chucK Posted March 10, 2003 Share Posted March 10, 2003 Dru said: If you can't write, don't write useless TRs pretending you can. If you can write feel free to write whatever you feel like writing. I say write TR's however you want, and ignore the peanut gallery. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cpt.Caveman Posted March 10, 2003 Share Posted March 10, 2003 Hey Dru there is a direct to R&D that goes at 5.9 and I climbed it. It's kind of sandy or was anyway. It leads up to Cocaine Crack. We puked on the ledge below the Cocaine Crack after I was tossing James Notgotmoney off the ledge into the abyss while the mutineers and visiting folks from Colorado looked on in disgust and disbelief. It was a nice belay test and sure thing that nobody wanted to que up on the line. The Ramp over right of it is a better climb. Smoca Bola~ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dru Posted March 10, 2003 Share Posted March 10, 2003 Ive got to remember that method of deterring crowds. Maybe next time you come up to Squamish we can try it out on the Apron Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cpt.Caveman Posted March 10, 2003 Share Posted March 10, 2003 Dru said: Ive got to remember that method of deterring crowds. Maybe next time you come up to Squamish we can try it out on the Apron It's a sure fire way to clear up Diedre so I can climb it without the crowds. Let's plan on it. I'll bring a whiskey bottle up too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erik Posted March 10, 2003 Share Posted March 10, 2003 Cpt.Caveman said: Dru said: Ive got to remember that method of deterring crowds. Maybe next time you come up to Squamish we can try it out on the Apron It's a sure fire way to clear up Diedre so I can climb it without the crowds. Let's plan on it. I'll bring a whiskey bottle up too don't forget to drop the empty bottle...shattered glass Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dru Posted March 10, 2003 Share Posted March 10, 2003 alpine simulator experience "if this was the rockies that woulda been a 50 lb. chunk of choss not a little bottle... and it woulda been puking spindrift Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlpineK Posted March 10, 2003 Author Share Posted March 10, 2003 (edited) Alpinhead Tom, This is where we started fighting, so I ain't going anywhere. While you were busy spraying about trip reports and how dangerous the avy conditions were yesterday I was out ripping up the freshiezz in the bc yesterday. Basicly Tom I could quit climbing right now and you would have a hard time catching up with me. My basic point isn't really that much different than yours. I've been around this site long enough to read a lot of stuff. I say if you are a good writer and willing to put time into writing. a long trip report may be ok, however most long trip reports I've read lack time spent editing and rewriting. I really like ChucK's interpretation of your post above. Edited March 10, 2003 by AlpineK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomcat Posted March 10, 2003 Share Posted March 10, 2003 AlpineK said: Basicly Tom I could quit climbing right now and you would have a hard time catching up with me. Where on earth did that come from? AlpineK, my impression of you is you're pretty full of yourself. I've read through your posts and one pattern that came up is your childish snippiness. I'll let you in on a little secret ... I don't care how much you've climbed, I never said a word about your climbing ability, and that's not up for discussion. If you feel you need to prove your climbing ability to me, enter a race or something. I don't even know you, I exchanged like 6 posts with you about the length of TRs and I come back to this thread expecting some intelligent, adult discussion and you're talking about how if you stopped climbing today I'd have a hard time catching up. It's pretty sad that you're all grown up and you can't have a civilized discussion on a bulletin board without resorting to personal attacks -- especially being a "moderator". AlpineK, I think you've got some issues chief. (they need a cuckoo clock icon on this thing!) And by the way, instead of contaminating threads by introducing personal attacks (Alpinhead Tom), why don't you exercise some common sense and take it to the Spray forum where it's supposed to be. You being a moderator I thought you would understand this better than anyone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dumpster_Diver Posted March 10, 2003 Share Posted March 10, 2003 AlpenTom said: AlpineK said: Basicly Tom I could quit climbing right now and you would have a hard time catching up with me. Where on earth did that come from? AlpineK, my impression of you is you're pretty full of yourself. I've read through your posts and one pattern that came up is your childish snippiness. I'll let you in on a little secret ... I don't care how much you've climbed, I never said a word about your climbing ability, and that's not up for discussion. If you feel you need to prove your climbing ability to me, enter a race or something. Why you feel you need to prove your climbing ability to me is beyond me. I don't even know you, I exchanged like 6 posts with you about the length of TRs and I come back to this thread expecting some discussion and you're talking about how if you stopped climbing today I'd have a hard time catching up. It's pretty sad that you're all grown up and you can't have a civilized discussion on a bulletin board without resorting to personal attacks -- especially being a "moderator". AlpineK, I think you've got some issues chief. And by the way, instead of contaminating threads by introducing personal attacks (Alpinhead Tom), why don't you exercise some common sense and take it to the Spray forum where it's supposed to be. You being a moderator I thought you would understand this better than anyone. AlpinheadTom, This seems to be a personal issue with AlpineK from an outside viewers seat. It seems obvious to me that you were making a point that better climbers are better people and that gives them the right to post long boring ass trip reports. Your silly remarks are as stupid as the ones you criticize coming from AlpineK. Maybe you should meet each other at the pube club and bitch slap each other. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Off_White Posted March 10, 2003 Share Posted March 10, 2003 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomcat Posted March 10, 2003 Share Posted March 10, 2003 Do you know how ridiculous you sound? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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