Mark O'Neal

I actually bought a replacement already...

I was using this Dyneema sling to backup a top rope anchor on kind of a goofy setup. The sling went through a horizontal crack and got this damage whilst I flailed about mightily in vain to climb the route. There doesn't appear to be any damage to the sling other than to the black cloth. My thought is that the black cloth isn't really doing anything. But a couple of guys at the crag were like "no way I'd use that dude!" Would you climb on it?

My two (well 3) cents. 1. You should avoid attaching to the anchor using a daisy chain as the chains are not fully sewn and as such, are not full strength. Buy a PAS (Personal Anchor System) if that's what you want to do. 2. I confess, I've lowered off of Sport routes. But the best thing for the longevity of the anchor (and your rope) is always to rap. Especially if you're attached to some sketchy chain with burrs on it. 3. Why not take that 2nd sling used to back up the first bolt and attach it to your harness and then the 2nd bolt. That way you have total redundancy. Yea yea. Nit picky....

I pulled a rope length through my setup and it imparted less twist than a munter. I don't know that I'll necessarily use it. Just thinking of options that aren't safety hazards. I'm thinking the MM would have too much friction on a snow slope to be usable to lower someone. I've been thinking of picking up the BD XP which might give me the extra friction I'm looking for but not be a specialized piece like a Reverso.

I think the rope looks like an "Edelweiss Discover 8mm x 30m Super Dry Twin Rope" Correct! Edelweiss Discover 8mm x 30m Super Dry Twin Rope. We're using it as a single for glacier travel and to climb moderate snow slopes (Gannett Peak in WY).

Yea, putting on a prussik or an autoblock is a good idea too. When I was playing around in the yard, I practiced prussiking up the 8mm rope using 5mm cord and it grabs plenty good.

Hmm. That's a thought. It appears like Petzl recently quit making the Reversino though. It seems to have limited availability. They offer the Verso now instead. Anyone used that on a thin rope yet? Still looking for some more comments on my strange ATC configuration. Mark

I saw the monster munter video after I made the post. I haven't tested it with body weigh yet, but I quickly set it up in the house. It had amazing friction and was easy to tie. It had more friction in fact than my modified ATC setup. I pulled a rope length through the ATC and didn't notice a ton of twisting, but there was a little. Here's a picture of my ATC setup and for reference the monster munter.

I'm planning on using an 8mm rope for the first time on a moderate snow climb. So I've been experimenting with how belaying would feel on the smaller rope. I realize the forces are much lower on the slope, but I experimented using full body weight. Long story short, I found that I couldn't create enough friction with a munter or an ATC on a single 8mm strand through 2 carabiners to be able to support my full body weight. After playing around a little I put the rope through the ATC normally, but then passed the free end back through the other side of the ATC (making an X across the top of the ATC), through the carabiner again and back up through the ATC. I created a ton of friction and was able to fully support and easily lower my full body weight. My question is: Is there anything wrong with setting up my ATC in this manner? It seemed OK to me when I looked at it, but I've never seen anyone do anything like that before. Thanks for any advice. Mark

They're bolted at the top because there is literally nowhere to place any pro in most places. We used to just tie off static ropes to large trees but the park service was nice enough to recently bolt it. In general, I think I'd rather clip the bolt for one less point of failure. My problem was that I felt like the biners, when clipped to the bolts, were in a bind between the bolt and the rock when the rope was weighted. I was incredulous when my buddies still insisted that was better than clipping the rap rings. Thanks for the advise, I feel vindicated.

I was climbing with some buddies yesterday. We were rigging TR anchors on some brand new bolts that were installed at the top of the climbs. I clipped the biners through the rap rings because the orientation of the bolts were such that my large lockers got bound up on the rock. My buddies insisted that you should always clip the bolt and not the rap ring. I agreed that the bolt is probably better, but ultimately I said that I didn't think it really mattered one way or the other as long as the ring is in good shape (in this case, brand new). I looked in my John Long Climbing Anchors book and while he didn't specify, I found pictures where he clipped the bolt and others where he clipped the rap ring. Long story short, what is the "right" way to do it. Clip the bolt, clip the rap ring, or clip whichever one is more convenient assuming the rap ring is in good shape?

Ah, see I knew I was missing something. You gotta love Google. They have the Luebben book online and I jumped right to the pages of interest. I'm not anticipating a big leader fall. I'm thinking I could be on a 45-50° slope and want to put a screw in, either as piece of mind fall protection or to rap down. I suck at making V-threads btw. So would the consensus be a 13cm?

Am I understanding you right? If the screw is too long and can't go all the way in to the hilt, you can sling it? Sling it where? At the ice line around the screw? I think I'm missing something because it would seem like the threads on the screw would be kinda sharp.

You make some good points. It depends on how many people I wind up with on the trip, but right now I was thinking 4. So I was figuring on having 2 people on each 30m rope. So if someone fell in, the other two would rig up the resuce on their rope. But perhaps it would be better to have all 4 folks on one rope so as to make arresting the fall easier. I own a 9.8mm 60m and my buddy owns an 8mm 30m. So I've been thinking about what I want to do. The only disadvantage of the 60m is the weight. Perhaps I should just force my buddies to carry all my food and the pro and we'll call it even...

If you were only going to carry one ice screw on a mixed alpine climb (as oh sh*t pro, it's icey here) What length would it be?

Interesting points. If I go the 8mm route, I was thinking of carrying 2X30m 8mm ropes. That way I have a 2nd rope if someone takes a crevasse fall, and if I need to rap off the route I'll tie the two ropes together. Plus I can split the rope weight between two people. How's that sound for a plan?

I've seen 8mm twin rope for sale marketed for glacier travel. Does anyone use an 8mm for rope glacier travel? What about as your main rope on a moderate snow slope (like Hood's south side)? I'm thinking of ways to save weight if I have a long backpack in to a climb. I know the 8mm twin rope is suppose to be doubled for rock climbing, but are the forces less on a snow slope / glacier that you can get away with using a single 8mm rope?

Thanks Hafilax, that's exactly what I was looking for. You must be a better Googler than I am, because I searched too. I'm still thinking that if you are using two independent slings/webbing you're probably OK with the girth hitch in certain circumstances. But the point is well taken that there shouldn't be any reason to go this route on TR. On a slightly separate issue, the Mammut article shows why you should backup your sling when using it to extend your rappel friction device. I was taught to tie a figure 8 in the middle of the sling, girth hitch one end to your belay loop and then backup the other end with a biner to your belay loop.

John Long's "Climbing Anchors 2nd ed." doesn't really directly address this issue. Although I can't recall one picture in the book where he doesn't use biners to extend anchors. He does however talk about building super bomber TR anchors versus "good enough" belay anchors. BTW, relax dude....

I have 8mm cordelette and 1" tubular webbing. The reason I ask is that I was reading the other day where a girth hitch can substantially reduce the breaking strength of webbing. So I got to thinking about which way would be better. I tend to think it would be better to go with the girth hitch rather than introduce more components into the system when using two pieces of webbing. If I was only using one piece of webbing I think I might want to reconsider using a locker instead of the hitch. But that's why I asked the question. Sounds like so far maybe on a TR ultimately its just personal preference.

Say I'm TR'ing and I've tied a cordelette around a tree, but I need to extend it further to get beyond the edge of the cliff. What would be the appropriate way to attach two sections of tied webbing to the bight on the cordelette? Is it OK to girth hitch both sections of webbing to the bight and then put two lockers on the far end? Or should I put two lockers on the bight, attach both sections of webbing to the lockers, and then use two more lockers on the far end?

Just a quick update. I took a week off. And then yesterday I taped up my middle fingers (just in case), warmed up, and hit the gym. I stuck to easy routes and tried to minimize gripping hard. A couple of times a had a little pain but quickly let go and reset. Felt pretty good afterwards and today as well. I think I'm on the probably on the right track. Thanks for the advice. BTW I found a nice article from Rock & Ice that seems to be pertinent to my problem. http://www.athlon.com.au/articles/r&i_bumwraps-thetruth.pdf

Agreed (but I still find the gym fun). I'll be out and about in the Cascades in July. I just have to make sure I'm healthy and strong.

The pain is generally inside the finger, but up until yesterday as mostly a dull ache (today they feel much better). As I find out more about the problem, I'm thinking that I'm irritating the tendons. You guys are probably onto something about the warming up. I haven't really warmed up as much as I've just jumped right onto the tough holds right away when I get there. I've never been a warming up kind of guy, but perhaps now that I'm pushing 40 its time to start. I'll take it easy next week and definitely try warming up first. I have noticed that the crimping and pockets put more strain on my fingers, so I think I'll try and keep to some easier routes for awhile and focus on footwork. I like the taping suggestion too and will give that a whirl. I've seen some places say tape the space in between the knuckles only, and some places say tape the spaces plus the knuckle to prevent the finger from bending. Which do you guys think is better? Thanks for all the great advise.

So should I be taping the spaces between each knuckle or should I be taping the spaces and the knuckle to keep the finger from bending?