ymir

respectfully, skykilo, i think that actually _you're_ blowing my comments out of proportion. i was surprised that people might want to do recreational climbing at a time and place on a smallish peak where they'd likely come damned close to climbers in dire distress, and that seems inconsiderate when they could hamper SAR efforts and are in summmit-mode rather than search mode...i thought it might be considerate to let SAR have the mountain for this one weekend and give them and the guys up there the best chance. i didn't say they should shut the mountain, in fact i said i opposed a formal shutting down. it just seems pretty straightforward to let SAR work unencumbered this weekend in the summit area of this one mountain. three guys are in trouble up there -- or, hopefully, just riding it out in a cave. either way it seems like a better idea to leave the area alone this weekend. that's a long way from saying people ought to move out of the PNW due to the weather, or become couch-mush. as a climber for 20 years i'm not the likeliest advocate of that position.

you bet, champ. i'll get right on that.

to give SAR and the guys the best chances, i'd say put a ring around the mountain starting at say 9k; anything above that i imagine is a good immeidate SAR area. not quite as small as i offhandedly said, but you can narrow it down...obviously things like yocum or steel cliff or castle crags probably aren't likely sites. but if it's all pristine (no tracks, caves, urine spots, lost or discarded items etc) above that because people make a considerate decision not to go above it, just this one weekend...couldn't that help at least by omission, so to speak? i could be completely wrong wiht my 9k figure but i'm thinking in this case, this weekend, err on the side of caution...or just climb something else this one weekend.

i don;t think the skiing should be closed, but i disagree -- mt. hood is tiny, when you consider the most likely places for a cave. and how do you know what side they're on? the ski lifts don't go too high. any activity above the lifts, unless recreational climbers are up there, should be of either SAR or the missing guys. that's pretty straightforward. why not give them every chance possible rather than muddy up the scene? it just seems thoughtless to tromp around in the immediately critical SAR area this exact weekend.

if the cave(s) is/are found, great. but a snowed-over cave might be hard to see, and ambiguous traces of any kind might passed by a person intent on the summit rather than intent on SAR. i don't think the mountain should be closed -- i think the fewer formal regulations the better -- but i _am_ surprised that climbers would _want_ to climb for climbing's sake right in the midst of one of the most intense search rescue areas (basically, anywhere on the N and S faces very near the summit).

finding the snow cave(s) would of course be the best thing, but, depending on a lot of variables, if one's not there to look for it, but to climb the mountain, it might not be noticed. whiteout, climbing in dark, out of direct line of sight (stomping past not over)...who knows. you might see a snow-cave-like shadow and think 'well that's probably not it' -- for wahtever reason -- and if you're there to get the summit, rather than there to look for climbers in dire need, you just might not follow up as you would if you were there in search mode. i'm just saying why not let SAR do their thing and 'go get some' somewhere else this weekend? (i know, sweatinoutliquor, that you're not the original poster of that phrase).

there you go, 'go get some' even though you might stomp right over or past the snow cave(s) in your quest for the summit, who cares, right, as long as _you_ go 'get some'? because life is of course all about you.

what i can't believe is that with people possibly perishing on the mountain *right now*, people still want to go up there and have some 'fun'. 'who cares, as long as i get my fix', eh?