MATT_B

I think OPB usual repeats Oregon Field Guide on Sunday. Too bad we don't have more ice here in oregon.

Correct me if I'm wrong but don't tiblocs work basically the same way ascenders do? If this is so, using them for simul climbing is a very very bad idea. It doesn't take much of an impact for an ascender to chop a rope. A number of people have died because of this. This is why they are not used for rope soling. I assume it would be to keep the climiber on the bottom from pulling off the guy on top. Maybe in a perfect world this would work but that will never happen. If you have to stop and rig up some kind of drectional your starting to defet the purpose (speed). As for the question of who goes first and who follows, I would argue if you need to ask the question, maybe you should just belay instead. When I have simul climbed, one person leads until the rack is almost gone. The leader sets up an anchor and belays. The second now has the rack. Once the belay is reached there is no reason to re-rack, just keep swapping leads. The other times if have simul climbed is on extra long pitches or when you thought there was enough rope to reach the next anchor. In this case you usually don't know until your almost out of rope. Too late to figure out who should be leading. Then the only option is to down climb to an anchor or simul. I know it is not often done but you can simul climb on aid too. I have done it a few times for short sections to link pitches together. Fortunetly when I have done it, it was planned so the leader left all gear in place for the first 20 feet or so. The other time the pitch started out on a bolt ladder.

To add to the speed thing. Lets say your roped up and have a couple of pitches of easy ground to cover where you don't need a rop. Above that are some harder pitches that you want to belay. It is a lot faster to stay roped up and simul-climb than to take the rope off and coil it up. It is also a good skill to have if you ever come accross a pitch where that rope is not quite long enough. Assuming the terain is easy enough and you are well in tune with your partner.

I remember reading something in the big wall book by John L and John M related to this. I can't quote it but it went something like, people can easily come up with lots of little reasons to bail off a climb when in reality there is no good reason too. It is kind of looking at this topic from another direction but probably just as valid. It is all part of the evaluation process. I have turned around for the wrong reasons more times than I care to admit. Some of my friends called it snail eye. You look up at a big climb, your eyes pop out of your head (like a snails) and you just want to hide in your shell. At times the difficulty lies in figuring out if the reasons to turn around are real or perceived. This is a difficult subject with lots of gray area. Anyone that has been climbing long enough can probably point to climbs where they should have turned back and didn't. We usually call them epics. As for giving someone crap for turning around, that is just lame.

hahaha, thats funny, Mountain Climbing for under 500$ hahaha Why not? I started with cheep crampons and an ice axe. Probably shoud have gotten a helmet too but didn't. You don't need an expensive backpack from REI and the latest greatest high tech clothing. Forget the GPS, learn to use a map and compas. Maybe a harness and belay device. A rope can come later once you have learned some of the basics. The point is you don't need much.

W face of leaning tower in a day, with a hangover, three quarts of water for two of us, in Auguast. Bad idea. The only reason we didn't bail is because it is so damn steep.

Elitist because it is expensive? You can easily get started for under $500. In the grand scheme of things that is not expensive. Could be much less depending on what you want to do, what you already have and who you know. What does a beginner polo horse cost these days? Once you have what ever equipment you need to get started, your not paying greens fees. Yes you need to replace ropes and shoes as they wear out but I'm sure that isn't as expensive as a set of racing slicks. Sure you can go to REI and drop the cash to rack up for a big wall but it is still going to cost less than a new ski boat. Elitist because you don't have to work a regular job? Most climbers do work a regular job. Most that don't are living, by choice, in poverty. What about the ones that climb for a living? Trust me, they are working their asses off. In most cases climbing is one of the perks of the job. If your looking for an elitist sport, please don't look here

My thoughts go out to the all the guys up on the hill. MntHigh makes some very good points. The teams that are up there officially are trained, organized and in comunication with each other. Anyone up there that is not part of the official search effort will likely cause confusion and be more of a hinderance. I have seen it happen. The best we can do is stay out of the way and let them do their job.

So whats the big deal if people are hush hush about climbing areas? There is plenty of info about plenty of places to clinb in oregon. Enough to keep most climbers busy for a lifetime. Why should I tell the world about some new place I found to climb if I don't feel like it for what ever reason? Your probably right that some peopel keep a tight lip about "their" climbing places for all all kinds or reasons, ego, impact conserns, what ever. That is their business. That being said, I'm all for sharing information. If you want info about an area I'll tell you what I know. On the other hand I'm not going to spray about every choss pile I come accross. Would it really be good if every one could get all the info they wanted on every hunk of stone in the state? It would kind of take some of the excitment out of exploring new areas.

I think one of the mags did an artical about alpine climbing in Japan a number of years ago.

You won't find much at that level. Go to the visitors center. They have several binders there full of route discriptions. I think the first couple pitches of space shot are pretty easy. If it where me, I would forget the climbing and go play in some of the slot canyons. Bring a rope and prepare to get your feet wet.

I remember hearing some great ones from the late Walt Shipley. One was on Mathes Crest. Something about acid and explosive diarrhoea . . .

I have never been in this area and was thinking about making the trip out for the weekend. Reading trip reports from this area and this time of year, it sounds like there will likely be a decent amount of snow still around. I will probably do the south ridge of ingles, maybe an easy to moderate route on stuart, or maybe something else. Not really sure yet. This leads me to two questions. First should I bring an axe and crampons or leave them at home. Anyone bee up there lately? Second, what routes would you recomend that would give me a good intro to the area. I have a good amount of experience but I have not been climbing much lately so I'm not up for anything too hard. Thanx in advance.

If this is the place I think it is, no climbing allowed there. A buddy of mine went there to climb and check it out and found no climbing signs. This was a couple of years ago. This could have changed or this could be another area but I don't think so. Anyone know anything more specific?

What time are they waking you up? There are usually city codes on when developers can start working. I had to complain to the city of portland about a deveoper that was making one hell of a lot of noise until late in the evening and then they would start up around 5:30 AM the next day. I think the code said they could work from 7 am to 6 pm in a residential area. The city was very responsive and followed up. I'm usually the last person to complain about something but this was a hell of a lot more noise than some saws and hammers.

Not me.

I hear Matt Baker posts here under SnailEye or something stupid like that.

When are climbers not responsible for exposing themselves to these risks?

Favorite climb I have ever done! Durring the day it is still very fun but crouded. On a night with a full moon it is increadable. I would also recomend Tenya peak, Echo peaks, Mathers Crest, Anything on Conness, South crack, West Country, Great White Book, The Yawn, Gaylens Crack and on and on. Danm it has been almost 8 years. I may need to do a summer road trip soon.

Some how I was under the impression it was your first wall but after re-reading it is obvious I'm an idiot. As for nailing at the collums, right or wrong I would expect to get a little flack and raise eyebrows for nailing anything there. I would bet there is some other place around that is a little quieter that you can go pound a little iron. Good luck on the trip, I hear good things about it.

What are you planning on doing for your first wall that you need to nail?

Madrone Wall on OPB web site: http://www.publicbroadcasting.net/opb/news.newsmain?action=article&ARTICLE_ID=873141

CLOGS KICKED ASS! I never had a set but a buddy of mine did. He dropped one off Washington Column just after they stopped making them and couldn't get a replacement. After that we literally got a side by side comparison of a Clog and a Petzel. If someone is now making them again and they are the quality of old, that would be my choice.

If I remember correctly they are cast aluminum. This tends to be brittle and can crack. The original design was not as stout as the ones on the market today. I don't think they were even originally designed for climbing. There have been several fatal accidents due to them breaking. John Dill, director of YOSAR (Yosemite Search and Rescue) has a collection of failed jumars and all kinds of other equipment. There where two places they would fail. One problem was the handle would break and fall off. If that is the only thing your connected to, down you go. The other part that would fail is the metal cup thingy (that is a technical term) that the rope sits in when the cam is engaged. When this came off the cam would have nothing to pinch the rope against and down you go. I don't think the original jumars where painted. You can easily identify the new ones by their yellow paint. Then new ones are built a lot better but a lot of people, my self included, still add some webbing just incase. Just remember to always tie in short especially when traversing.

oh joy! more reality TV.