NY Gully

[daylward]

Did a semblance of this route yesterday (Friday) with Tim Matsui. Definitely thin, but it was quite enjoyable. I think we were slightly off route, because we didn't see many of the landmarks pointed out by Nelson/Potterfield. We didn't see any section that required aid, any trees (other than a large old snag at the beginning of pitch 3 that isn't described in Selected Climbs), no 8" offwidth or chockstone... but we did find some fixed pins and our route roughly followed the line in the Selected Climbs picture... Here's our experience:

 

We got on the route about 100 yards up Enigma Gully from the base of the face, moving leftward on mostly snow-covered slabs; it was the obvious place to start, because it formed a wide sloping ramp up towards the middle of the face. This matches the Selected Climbs description. We linked the first two pitches together in a running a belay. We made the first belay at a large snag in what could be considered a "box" (maybe we didn't go far enough up & left before making our first belay?). At the time we felt confident that we were in the right place, because we were at the bottom of the obvious right-slanting ramp that we'd seen from below which we had decided was the route. The ramp was sparsely iced, it turned out to be excellent and challenging mixed climbing; especially challenging to avoid the loose rock. About halfway up this pitch (our second belayed pitch, presumably corresponding to Nelson's 3rd described pitch) the ramp turns into a wide slot (in other words, there's a roof overhead). Before leaving the upper end of the slot, there were two fixed pins nailed into the face (an angle and an arrow) on the climber's left. Reaching the end of the ramp, the obvious course of travel turns left (straight up) up a snowy V-groove. We had to running-belay about 20 feet for me to reach the first available belay spot, just to the left of the top part of the V-groove, out of the line of fire, where I could stamp out a super belay stance and stick in a bomber 3" cam. Tim led the next pitch - above the V-groove to the right, up a steep slabby rightward ramp, he was thankful for frozen moss & heather to make up for the lack of water ice. He found a belay in 50 meters of difficult mixed climbing, up in the sun, in an alcove of rock above a thin snow slope. I took the next pitch slightly left and up dry rock, into another fairly steep ramp/gully facing slightly right, where some ice was formed and I actually got a few good sticks in among the many tool hooks and cams and actual handholds... then it emptied out onto a mellow snowy hump. I kept going to the top of the hump, then cut left up a rock ramp, before belaying when rope drag was too great from all the zigzags. Apparently Tim had to running-belay for 50 feet or so. The last pitch was easy & short to the ridge crest, but then we had to downclimb to the right and then traverse a steep high snowfield (hanging into the top of Enigma Gully) to get to the actual shoulder of Snoqualmie Mt. We realized we could have avoided the detour to the top of the ridge crest if I had simply gone around the corner to the right from the top of the snowy hump instead of going up into the leftward rock ramp.

 

Forrest and Ade are doing it today. I gave them our beta, we'll see what they say, and if they figure out where/if we went wrong...

 

Dan

[Colin]

Dan,

 

Nice job! Glad to hear you liked it!

 

"We got on the route about 100 yards up Enigma Gully from the base of the face"

 

Actually, that is not Enigma Gully, but a different one. Enigma Gully (or Slot Couloir) is the much deeper gully, further to the East (to the left of NY Gully, looking up).

 

The dead snag is definitely where you turn up into the box gully. After that, it sounds like you were on route, but it's hard to tell. Perhaps if I describe how the route went from there from my memory, you might be able to confirm if you went the same way:

 

From the dead snag, the route goes straight up the box gully for about 65 meters, to a belay on the left wall, where there is a little snow to stand on. This pitch has two fixed pins from Ruch and Cotter, and is the crux of the route. I think that the last 30 ft. of this pitch might incorporate your "v-slot."

 

The next pitch goes straight up the end of the "box gully"(starting out on the right-hand wall), up some mixed snow groove, and then across a little football-shaped slab, to the base of the offwidth corner.

 

The third pitch from the snag makes a move or two up the offwidth, before clipping a Ruch/Cotter knifeblade on the left wall, and then climbing about 30 ft. up to a belay next to a tree. The beggining of this pitch is steep, and is where Mark and I made an aid move or two.

 

From the belay next to the tree, do not continue up, (as shown in the picture in Selected Climbs) as it is merely a sub-summit. Instead, climb about 80 meters of 4th class mixed terrain, up to a saddle to the right of the sub-summit. From here, make a quick rap into the top of the Enigma Gully, and then climb the last 100 ft. of it up to the West Ridge, which quickly leads to the summit.

 

It sounds like you guys definitely made the correct first pitch from the snag (you saw the two fixed pins), and probably the second as well. What I can't tell is if you went up the "offwidth crack" to the fixed pin on the left wall. Perhaps this is your "slightly left and up dry rock?" The knifeblade here was the same funky forged type from the earlier pitch (with a single eye, that has been rotated about 30 degrees).

 

Did Tim take many pictures?

 

 

 

Edited January 11, 2003 by Colin

[daylward]

Ah, I think you're right, the "up and left on dry rock" was where I skipped the offwidth, and thereby missed the tree belay. I did wander around to the right to check out the options, and I saw a sort of shallow-dihedral-corner with a fairly wide (but I don't know if I'd say offwidth) crack. I didn't look closely enough to see if there was a fixed pin, but I could imagine the first couple moves requiring a little aid (or rock shoes, if you happen to have them along... ;-). A quick assessment convinced me that going up and left would be a little easier, and it turned out to be about 5.6, and led to a ramp with more good mixed climbing. So I'd say that was a nice variation for that pitch in that it needed no aid. Also, it seems our detour to the sub-peak allowed us to get to the west ridge with only downclimbing and snowfield-traversing instead of rapping, so that turned out nice as well.

 

Cool, now it maks more sense, thanks Colin! :-)

 

Oh yes, and Tim did take quite a few pictures, but of course he used film so he'll have to get them developed & scanned.

[Lambone]

Nice climbing fellas, thanks for posting the info. Dan, what sort of rack did you tote up there? Would you recomend bringing more or less?

[Alex]

Didnt see any Ade Miller there yesterday; forrest_m, was that you with another partner?

[layton]

I've got a question about this route. I'm sure I'll get flamed for sure. 1st, how long did it take you guys, and colin too . The guidebook time seems too long.

 

2nd, what makes this a good route?

 

The reason I ask is b/c everyone seems to say it would be sweet w/ice on it, as I would expect. BUT, with no ice on it except for snow, people still are climbing it. What's the point in doing it as a winter climb when it sounds like it's just a rock climb? If it's just a rock climb, then would it be a good summer climb. I expect the answer to be no, so then why would it be a good no-ice winter climb? Seems kinda pointless and contrived just to do it 'cuz it is winter outside. Unless you plan on climbing it more than once, would you advise to wait until it's iced up nicely to get the real experience of the route?

 

Regardless, I still would like to do it and kudos to those that did it. I hope my question makes sense, if not, I'll try and rephrase it.

[Colin]

Mike,

 

The first time that Mark and I did it we bivied at the West Ridge notch, and still didn't get back to the car until about 8 pm the next day. The second time, however, under much better conditions, we took about 14 hours car-to-car.

 

It's not an ice climb, it's a mixed route. Just because there isn't a lot of swinging doesn't mean that there isn't ice. The climbing on it is really fun - lots of hooking your picks in cracks, and whatnot. I definitely wouldn't reccomend it as a summer route, because the rock is too loose.

[layton]

Thanks!

The reports sounded like it wasn't mixed, just snow covered rock. Guess I read wrong. Guess I have to wait, since the avy conditions on the approach right now must be serious.

[Dru]

Snow covered rock IS Mixed climbing as the Scots define it. Drytooling to hanging ice daggers is just a North American/Euro aberration.

[pms]

Colin,

 

I'm thinking what Dan is calling Enigma Gully (where he and Tim started) is what Ruch describes to me as the gully leading to his "Washington Dihedrals" route. What do you think?

 

It sounds like a good moderate alternate to NY Gully? I figure any way you get to the summit of Noquality Mt. is a good way.

[Colin]

Jim,

 

The gully that Dan and Tim started up is definitely the correct/normal one for getting to NY Gully (the one you describe as "the major snow gully separating this subsidiary peak and Snoqualmie's steep north wall proper.").

 

I know of two parties (in fact, I think that one was Brian) that have gone in to try NY Gully, decided that it did not look good, and instead continued up that main snow gully, until it tops out on the West Ridge. I think I heard it described as fairly easy alpine ice and mixed. Is this main gully Ruch's "Washington Dihedrals" route?

 

When traversing below the N face of the western sub-peak (as to get to NY Gully), one crosses below a couple cool-looking dihedrals. They look like they would be good mixed climbing, increasing in difficulty from the furthest right to the furthest left. There is also a dihedral that branches off of the Enigma Gully, on the climber's left-hand wall, that looks like it could be pretty fun. I don't think that any of these dihedrals I'm describing have been climbed, and if Ruch described "Washington Dihedrals" as being easier than NY Gully, then my geuss is that it is the main snow gully (that NY Gully branches off of).

 

Did that make any sense?

[highclimb]

Colin,

 

i know that a couple years ago Dan Smith went in to climb NY Gully but didnt end up climbing it for some reason. Instead his partener and him climbed a "gulley" in between the notch and NY. he described it as swinging into frozen pieces of moss. so maybe talk to him, he might have some information. just a thought.

 

Aidan

[Colin]

Yep. Dan was one of the two parties I was thinking of. The gully that he climbed (and is perhaps "Washington Dihedrals") is the main snow gully that NY Gully branches left from.

[daylward]

To answer Lambone's question regarding gear:

 

We brought a single set of cams ranging from green alien to #3 camalot, a set of nuts, about 5 stubby pins, and 5 ice screws. That turned out to be about right in terms of the cams & nuts, and we pounded in a couple of the pins during the climb, but nowhere was the ice thick enough to put in a screw (except possibly in some contrived and unnecessary location). In general, the route was fairly easy to protect. No excessive runouts.

[daylward]

Didnt see any Ade Miller there yesterday; forrest_m, was that you with another partner?

 

I'm pretty sure Forrest said he went with Ade... He'll be in at work shortly to clarify.

[daylward]

1st, how long did it take you guys, and colin too

 

It took us about 8 hours on route, 14 hours car to car (we had a slight episode of misdirection on the approach). Forrest said they took around 6 hours on route. Forrest likes to think that's because he's a faster and more efficient winter alpinist. I like to think it's because he had our tracks to follow!

 

2nd, what makes this a good route?

 

There was not much ice on the route, but there was by no means none. There was enough to hold lots of the loose rock together, and enough to make an attempt to climb it without ice tools & crampons much too difficult & even foolish. Ice tools turn frozen lumps of moss & heather into great handholds!

 

Climbing it in these conditions is much different than the thwack-thwack chunk-chunk it would be if it were totally iced up, but it is still a very good time. It really makes you think... you have to decide each step of the way if it's better to use a tool placement in ice or dirt or moss, or to hook your tool on a rock or cam it in a crack, or simply let your tool dangle from your arm & use your hand. It takes a while to become efficient at this kind of climbing (which I admit I'm not!)

[Lambone]

Thanks Dan!

[forrest_m]

Just a few things to add:

 

Ade and I did the route on Saturday, just ahead of the bad weather (it started just as we topped out.) It took us about 10.5 hours RT from the car. Dan's right that following their tracks up the snow gully saved us some time, although Dan and Tim are both so skinny that they weren't able to really pack out good enough steps for me and Ade. We also didn't leave the car until it was light enough to see so we didn't get lost in the woods. I had done the approach before, which also helped. We also missed the knifeblade crack, the 5.6 gully-to-more mixed climbing seemed like the logical continuation to us. We climbed from the snow gully to the big dead snag in one simul-climbing pitch, then topped out in two rope-stretching pitches before traversing out following Dan & Tim's tracks.

 

The first time I hiked in there, we also followed the big snow gully to the top. I thought that WAS the enigma couloir, but apparently it's not. About halfway up, that gully cuts right, while a huge, super-obvious low-angle dihedral goes straight up. This looked good, and I think it's probably the Washington Dihedral route.

 

As for the route description confusion, I think that the big chockstone that forms the cave that is described in Nelson has fallen out. Apart from this one item, the description fits. I'm not sure where the "crux" was, one of the things that impressed me about the route was how consistent the pitches were. It seemed like there were challenging moves on every pitch, though it is never desperate. I also like the fact that the route threads a seemingly improbable line up a very steep face.

 

[pms]

Colin and Forrest,

 

I think we agree about the location of Ruch and Liddell's Washington Dihedrals route. All sound good, especially the NY what you guys did. Sounds like you had fun.

 

I would like you to see the aerial pics that Cauthorn took on Wed., as they showed the various route options well. How did some of the lines on the lower western sub-peak look?

[Ade]

Dru - In Scotland if it's got frozen water on it then it's "in". Doesn't even have to be snow, I'm told hoar-frost is acceptable, but frozen turf is the key (dig out those old warthogs - excellent in turf).

 

The lines on the sub peak looked interesting, interesting enough to go back in for. Does anyone know anything about them? There's a big slot/corner up the center that's pretty obvious.

 

[DPS]

For the sake of historical accuracy I feel I should clarify the route that Nick and I climbed instead of NY Gully. We had every intention of climbing NY Gully but had a disagreement as to where the traverse to the base of the box gully began. We ended up climbing above the correct traverse and then traversed left into a gully system. The climbing was pretty easy most of the way. We climbed a steepish dihedral getting sticks in moss. We roped up to get past a steep head wall of mixed sugar snow and rock. I never knew this route had a name.

Edited January 14, 2003 by danielpatricksmith

[wayne]

One of the tings that makes this climb interesting is its steepness. It would be an interesting angle even in summer with rock shoes. You have dihedrals to stem it out though.

I did it solo in 5 hrs.

[Ade]

So I'm told that Ruch has done a bunch of routes up in the Snoqualmie area, nothing appears in Beckey however. Are these documented anywhere?

[Cpt.Caveman]

ask mattp. He climbed with him this past summer. I've only met the dude a couple times.

[mattp]

Ade-

I emailed Jim Ruch and he replied that (regarding winter climbs at Snoqualmie Pass) "I've done all the regular stuff and a few first ascents. The NY Gully and the Washington Dihedral are the firsts. The NY Gully is well documented but the Washington Dihedral has never been documented to the best of my knowledge. It's really only a practice area to the left of the NW face of Mt. Snoqualmie I did with Bill Lidell years ago. A couple of good pitches of mixed climbing in a dihedral. I have some pictures I can dig out if you want them. "