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How do you clip your belay biner to your harness?


Alyosha

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I clip my "belay biner" (HMS locking biner to which I attach my belay device) to my harness's belay loop, which is what the instructions that come with my harness tell me to do.

 

But I've seen a few people who cheerfully disregard the fact that their harness is equipped with that belay loop thing, and clip their "belay biner" through the leg piece and the waist piece of their harness, the way the rope would go for tie-in (or perhaps simply clip it around the leg piece and the harness waist belt -- I haven't looked closely enough to remember exactly). Whenever I asked them to explain why they're doing it this way, all I got was "my friend/husband/boyfriend/girlfriend/dog/cat/hamster, who has been climbing for ten years does it that way." My reaction to that iron-clad argument has generally been "and my great-grandpa used to tie a hemp rope around his waist, and call it good, but he died." Yet nagging doubt remains, "maybe, I'm missing something here?" Am I? (Their friend who told them to do it that way never seems to be on hand confused.gif) Note that I'm not asking about harnesses that don't have a belay loop by design.

 

Thank you

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I don't have a harness with a belay loop anymore, but I used to. I've always put the belay 'biner through the tie-in point. I've found that having the belay device closer to me makes it easier to bring in rope more quickly. Seems like having the belay device dangle down on that belay loop would be a PITA too.

 

If this practice of mine is gonna kill me or my partner, I'd love to find this out before it does. An in depth explanation would also be appreciated.

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I used to set up my belay similar, but the current wisdom (vie Petzl, I believe) is that clipping in through the waist loop and crotch loop can create a triaxial load on the belay biner. hence - the clip in through the belay loop. If you use a grigri, the setup actually works better, as the grigri is perpendicular to the biner, and the rope can be fed/controlled a bit smoother. Another reason - if you are on a multi-pitch, it can be a pain to thread the belay biner through the same loops that you are tied in to.

 

final note - the belay loop is typically the strongest loop/stiching in the harness. Of course, always tie in through the waist/crotch loop combo though, because these points are reinforced to take the wear and tear of the rope abrasion.

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Another reason - if you are on a multi-pitch, it can be a pain to thread the belay biner through the same loops that you are tied in to.

confused.gif

 

Do you take your belay device and biner on and off or something? What does multipitch have to do with it?

Edited by chucK
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BD says the same thing as Petzl on this, i.e. not using the belay loop is more likely to cross load the belay biner and is therefor bad. This may be true in general but I also notice that using the belay loop actually makes it more likely the biner will slip completely sideways, loading the rope directly on the gate. This is not a good thing, obviously. However I always use the belay loop just cuz it's easier and less clusterfucky when you're tied into the rope.

 

I've heard people say they belay off the tie in points b/c of redundancy and a one-less-link-to-break theory. This seems a little silly since I think the number of reported cases of belay loop failure is zero, but whatever floats yer boat.

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BD says the same thing as Petzl on this, i.e. not using the belay loop is more likely to cross load the belay biner and is therefor bad. This may be true in general but

This probably depends on the harness you are using. The BD Alpine Bod harness, for example, has no belay loop whatsoever. And I believe it is a perfectly safe harness for belaying, when used correctly. It's pretty much the only harness I use.

 

Just my $0.02.

Edited by Stephen_Ramsey
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Of course, always tie in through the waist/crotch loop combo though, because these points are reinforced to take the wear and tear of the rope abrasion.

As a creature of habit, I always tied in the same way -- that being consistently to the same side of the belay loop. Had I alternated which side of the belay loop I tied in through, I probably wouldn't have a harness that was theadbare on one side of the belay loop and pristine on the other.

 

Kinda like rotating your tires.

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I kindof like putting the biner through leg loop and waist loop when big lead whippers are a possibility since there is often slack in the rope when belaying a lead so the biner kindof flops around on the belay loop and could be loaded across the gate. your mileage may vary. maybe my concern is unfounded.

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yeah but it doesn't have the abrasion resistance that honkin belay loop has. Some people extend their belay devices that way when rappeling to get increased manuverability and a bit of extra friction, esp. when doing a pickoff or something similar.

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on a related note when climbing a multipitch, you finish belaying and start climbing, do you move your belay device and biner back to a gear loop or leave it clipped to your belay loop where it can clunk you in the nads and get stuck in gear/rope as you clean? yellaf.gif the correct answer to this question should be obvious

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